Thread: **HELP** 04 GTP SC shifts but wont drive

Originally Posted by BillBoost37

Oh...I have plenty. TEP is one of them.

TEP? I'm a rook dont forget haha. I might end up just buying the whole rebuild kit and suck it up..... If I go this route. What do you guys think I should do, as far as which Tranny to Choose to rebuild.... My Tranny has 185K to my knowledge and the Yard Tranny has 160K.. You guys already seen the damage in mine and in the Yard Tranny... I have yet to take my Tranny out. But I guess I'll have to do that and take both apart to see what parts to keep...........

I dont know if small metal fragments in the filter is better than burnt out clutch bands???

I got those caps and tubes though

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Figured it out. Triple Edge Performance

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Ok, sweet!.. I've been doing some research myself and theres nothing like knowing exactly what you're looking at. I'm taking major notes from you. Please do send what you recommend. Appreciate it all! Thanks.

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Originally Posted by BillBoost37

The yard tranny for sure. That way you can return it and still get another.

I found that in order to do the 1st/3rd clutches I had to extend the tool

Gotcha!.. Was this a tool you made or purchased?

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Originally Posted by BillBoost37

In the links to stuff WSTE posted, it's the third link. I bought the bottom threaded nut/etc from tractor supply in order to make the tool long enough to use. I'm interested to hear how he found it long enough for that hub.

You're 100% right bill! I ended up using this tool in my shop press and basically just used the press to push the tool down rather than deal with the threads, and that works for me, but now that I look at your extension, I think that would be a much easier way! Luckily the snap ring and compression on that clutch spring is pretty low from what I remember so it's not that bad either way. I would say to try Bill's extension method first though because it's probably vastly easier to grab the snap ring without the press being in your way.

As far as the kits, this is the kit I've used a few times: https://www.ebay.com/itm/4T65E-2004-On-GM-Tap-Shift-Super-Master-Rebuild-Kit-With-Pawl-Lug-Input-Friction/272494991653?epid=672397377&hash=item3f71f79925:g: 5lAAAOSwNSxVCzs8&vxp=mtr

Along with: 4T65E Transmission Solenoid Kit Set TCC, 2 Shift, EPC, Switch 2003 UP 84420AK | eBay

I also recommend at the bare minimum for the valve body: GM 4T65E Transmission AFL Valve Repair Kit | P1811 Code Stopper | SUPERIOR K098 | eBay

If you really want to future proof your rebuild, I'd get this instead of the above afl repair: Sonnax SC4T65E Transmission . 4t65e 91-99 | eBay

The last link includes the lube tube retainer along with seletable shims for the thrust clearances. A lot of rebuilders neglect to check this movement, but it is discussed in the video manual I cited.

These are what I use in all my rebuilds partly because I like to fix it once and fix it well rather than doing it again in a few years, and partly because I'm ocd. Take it as you will. Personally, I don't think $500 is unreasonable for parts cost to get a transmission that will likely outlast the car.

One note, while not always necessary to change, the kit does come with the case bushings and such that need to be pressed in. I got lucky and used various sockets with my shop press to install them and it worked, but it may not always work like that. I'd check them and if you can't catch your fingernail on them, you're probably good to go.

The one bearing I highly recommend replacing is: Amazon.com: AC Delco 75086 BR Needle Bearing, Converter: Automotive

As this bearing is known to grenade with age. It is press fit, so removing and installing will require a press, but most shops don't mind doing this for you for a small fee.

I usually clean and reuse the other needle bearings. The video goes over how to properly clean and inspect the bearings.

Sorry for the long description, but hopefully that helps!

Originally Posted by wstefan20

You're 100% right bill! I ended up using this tool in my shop press and basically just used the press to push the tool down rather than deal with the threads, and that works for me, but now that I look at your extension, I think that would be a much easier way! Luckily the snap ring and compression on that clutch spring is pretty low from what I remember so it's not that bad either way. I would say to try Bill's extension method first though because it's probably vastly easier to grab the snap ring without the press being in your way.

As far as the kits, this is the kit I've used a few times: https://www.ebay.com/itm/4T65E-2004-On-GM-Tap-Shift-Super-Master-Rebuild-Kit-With-Pawl-Lug-Input-Friction/272494991653?epid=672397377&hash=item3f71f79925:g: 5lAAAOSwNSxVCzs8&vxp=mtr

Along with: 4T65E Transmission Solenoid Kit Set TCC, 2 Shift, EPC, Switch 2003 UP 84420AK | eBay

I also recommend at the bare minimum for the valve body: GM 4T65E Transmission AFL Valve Repair Kit | P1811 Code Stopper | SUPERIOR K098 | eBay

If you really want to future proof your rebuild, I'd get this instead of the above afl repair: Sonnax SC4T65E Transmission . 4t65e 91-99 | eBay

The last link includes the lube tube retainer along with seletable shims for the thrust clearances. A lot of rebuilders neglect to check this movement, but it is discussed in the video manual I cited.

These are what I use in all my rebuilds partly because I like to fix it once and fix it well rather than doing it again in a few years, and partly because I'm ocd. Take it as you will. Personally, I don't think $500 is unreasonable for parts cost to get a transmission that will likely outlast the car.

One note, while not always necessary to change, the kit does come with the case bushings and such that need to be pressed in. I got lucky and used various sockets with my shop press to install them and it worked, but it may not always work like that. I'd check them and if you can't catch your fingernail on them, you're probably good to go.

The one bearing I highly recommend replacing is: Amazon.com: AC Delco 75086 BR Needle Bearing, Converter: Automotive

As this bearing is known to grenade with age. It is press fit, so removing and installing will require a press, but most shops don't mind doing this for you for a small fee.

I usually clean and reuse the other needle bearings. The video goes over how to properly clean and inspect the bearings.

Sorry for the long description, but hopefully that helps!

This is exactly what I needed. Very detailed. Love it! Pretty much covers everything. I just have to get the right tools for the job and see if I can get some help with the parts you mentioned, that I might need a press for. All I'll need is a torque converter maybe?

Time to execute now. Thanks!

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Originally Posted by showtastiik

This is exactly what I needed. Very detailed. Love it! Pretty much covers everything. I just have to get the right tools for the job and see if I can get some help with the parts you mentioned, that I might need a press for. All I'll need is a torque converter maybe?

Time to execute now. Thanks!

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Thanks! And you didn't hear me say this, but in a pinch, I've used different sized sockets and a soft mallet to install and a very very steady hand with a dremmel tool and cutoff wheel to cut almost all the way through the bearing then use a very carefully placed small chisel to "deform" the bearing and force it out. Now, I'm not saying this is the right way to do it, but it works as long as you're careful!

And sorry I forgot to mention the torque converter. Yes, I 100% recommend replacing the torque converter. It is made of woven carbon and tends to hold a lot of "nasties" and isn't rebuildable, so often if you re-use one, it'll dump crud and clog up the channel plate filter and cause it to burn up pretty quick. Not worth trying to save money on it.

Originally Posted by wstefan20

Thanks! And you didn't hear me say this, but in a pinch, I've used different sized sockets and a soft mallet to install and a very very steady hand with a dremmel tool and cutoff wheel to cut almost all the way through the bearing then use a very carefully placed small chisel to "deform" the bearing and force it out. Now, I'm not saying this is the right way to do it, but it works as long as you're careful!

And sorry I forgot to mention the torque converter. Yes, I 100% recommend replacing the torque converter. It is made of woven carbon and tends to hold a lot of "nasties" and isn't rebuildable, so often if you re-use one, it'll dump crud and clog up the channel plate filter and cause it to burn up pretty quick. Not worth trying to save money on it.

Haha thanks. I'll keep that in mind when the time comes and I'm desperate. A lot of good info here. Love it!

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Originally Posted by BillBoost37

In the links to stuff WSTE posted, it's the third link. I bought the bottom threaded nut/etc from tractor supply in order to make the tool long enough to use. I'm interested to hear how he found it long enough for that hub.

Hey BillBoost, can you send me a link from Tractor Supply of what threaded nut/etc you bought. I'm getting ready to make all my purchases for the rebuild now. Thanks!

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Any suggestions on torque converters? I'm now shopping around for one.

With my CNC ported heads, I might be looking into either, just 1.9 rockerarms or just grabbing a Camshaft since my old trans have to come out.

I'm looking forward to showing off all parts in this thread once I start taking both the yard and my Trans apart. Educate others. Especially with my issues, with only sometines D,R,1,2&3 not working. Cant forget a little grinding noise on acceleration. From my research and how my filter looks, I'm hoping to find the overdrive clutch hub to be stripped. Thinking that's where the metal is coming from. But all in all, I cant wait to show and tell what went mostly went wrong in my Trans. On the otherside, the yard Trans will definitely be a "What the hell happen" as well. I'm not sure how many ppl online cut open their filters on failed Transmissions but they'll definitely get an idea once I fully open up both.

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Originally Posted by showtastiik

Any suggestions on torque converters? I'm now shopping around for one.

With my CNC ported heads, I might be looking into either, just 1.9 rockerarms or just grabbing a Camshaft since my old trans have to come out.

I'm looking forward to showing off all parts in this thread once I start taking both the yard and my Trans apart. Educate others. Especially with my issues, with only sometines D,R,1,2&3 not working. Cant forget a little grinding noise on acceleration. From my research and how my filter looks, I'm hoping to find the overdrive clutch hub to be stripped. Thinking that's where the metal is coming from. But all in all, I cant wait to show and tell what went mostly went wrong in my Trans. On the otherside, the yard Trans will definitely be a "What the hell happen" as well. I'm not sure how many ppl online cut open their filters on failed Transmissions but they'll definitely get an idea once I fully open up both.

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Great thinking! Definitely easier to swap a cam with the trans out of there.

As far as torque converters, unless you're going all out with a custom built torque converter, I just recommend the usual brands. I think I went with proking since they were cheap at the time. Haven't had any issues with them so far.

I'm glad you're taking the time to document the process! I meant to, but my first transmission broke right after I rebuilt the engine and I wanted to get it back on the road asap. I'll probably be upgrading some internals this summer so I'll definitely have to document mine as well! Can't wait to see the thread anyhow, and hope you have as much fun as I did rebuilding it! They're not for the faint of heart, but I do think people give them a bad wrap as being overly complex to service.

Originally Posted by wstefan20

Great thinking! Definitely easier to swap a cam with the trans out of there.

As far as torque converters, unless you're going all out with a custom built torque converter, I just recommend the usual brands. I think I went with proking since they were cheap at the time. Haven't had any issues with them so far.

I'm glad you're taking the time to document the process! I meant to, but my first transmission broke right after I rebuilt the engine and I wanted to get it back on the road asap. I'll probably be upgrading some internals this summer so I'll definitely have to document mine as well! Can't wait to see the thread anyhow, and hope you have as much fun as I did rebuilding it! They're not for the faint of heart, but I do think people give them a bad wrap as being overly complex to service.

Yeah, maybe someone out there will be as confident as I am for the first time. Let me remind everyone, I'm only 2 months in on modding and only did my topside of the engine for the first time a month ago..... Correct the mistakes I make. But with the help of you guys, I think I'll be alright but you still never know haha. It's always something....

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Originally Posted by BillBoost37

Brandon did a great write up IIRC.

The absolute needed items I found were the teflon seal resizer sleeve, that clutch tool and the engine stand with trans bracket. I made my own bracket after seeing pictures. Being able to put this trans tail down was extremely helpful to me during reassembly since I didn't have all the correct tools. Don't get discouraged when putting the 3rd sprag into the clutches, I like to use two small screwdrivers or picks to line up the clutches as well as possible.

Shoot thanks bill! So I got a trick an old mechanic taught me. Grab a small funnel that lightly tapers, use a heat gun to warm the teflon and push up the funnel lubricated with trans fluid to stretch the seal. Then take some thin plastic sheet (I used an old cut up coke liter cut to square) then roll it up and lubricate with trans fluid. Wrap around the shaft where the seal goes and slip it right into the grove. Now wrap that same sheet around the seals and place a hose clamp around each seal and leave for half an hour. Then enjoy the fact you didn't have to spend on that tool!

Oh, and Bill pointed out an error I made earlier. I was confused and thinking the engine was also coming out of the car, then swapping the cam is easy. ButI don't see doing this with the engine in and trans out. I'd be better to wait till the trans is in and drop the side subframe method. Still not my favorite option, but it works

Originally Posted by wstefan20

Shoot thanks bill! So I got a trick an old mechanic taught me. Grab a small funnel that lightly tapers, use a heat gun to warm the teflon and push up the funnel lubricated with trans fluid to stretch the seal. Then take some thin plastic sheet (I used an old cut up coke liter cut to square) then roll it up and lubricate with trans fluid. Wrap around the shaft where the seal goes and slip it right into the grove. Now wrap that same sheet around the seals and place a hose clamp around each seal and leave for half an hour. Then enjoy the fact you didn't have to spend on that tool!

Oh, and Bill pointed out an error I made earlier. I was confused and thinking the engine was also coming out of the car, then swapping the cam is easy. ButI don't see doing this with the engine in and trans out. I'd be better to wait till the trans is in and drop the side subframe method. Still not my favorite option, but it works

So if I skip installing the Cam, you'll recommend me to keep the engine in, drop subframe yo take original Trans out, rebuild the yard Trans and than install it while engine is in from under the car?


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Originally Posted by BillBoost37

Brandon did a great write up IIRC.

Do you have a link by chance?

Also @ OP, I helped you get the part number for that broken cap from fb. lol