Thread: Injector help/Look at my tune

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  1. #1 Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    hey guys/gals I just put 60 pound injectors in my 05 grand prix. (s1x cam + 3.2 + every thing else ). I am running pig rich at wot 9.5-10.5. I try and subtract 3-5 % in fuel from mas but dose not change much. this is what my IFR is currently set to ifr.jpg i am using hp tuner (im new to) and ngk afr. any help would be great thanks (I have seen the charts out there but do no fully understand.)
    .

    this is a like to my current tune if you want to have a look. Thanks

    sept2021timing.hpt - Speedy Share - upload your files here
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  2. #2 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    I AM PEWPIN! rynoman03's Avatar
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    Have you adj your fuel injector tables at all? You seem to be adding more than my 42's. Have you looked up any 60# injector tables then adj your flow rates to make up for the change your car has now? I haven't done any adj for 60# injectors but I know several on here have and they probably have some tables for you to plug in and make it a bit better. I know Reptile runs 60# injectors. BillBoost might have tables for you as well. That's who I got my 42# injector tables from and since I made those adj things have been alot better with my fuel econ as well.

    Flow vs KPA then Offset vs volts needs adj most likely.

    What's your Base AFR vs ECT table look like. That's where you set your AFR.

    Are you on HP Tuners forum at all? HP Tuners Bulletin Board

    If not register there are lot of helpful folks on there too! I've learned alot on there.
    1999 GTPHP Tuned, Ported SC/TB, 42#'s, SSAC's, ZZP Modded 1.9's/LS6 Springs/Manley's, TransGo Shift Kit, Poly Uppers, KYB GR2's/Springtech's. - 231k and traded it in. - Gone
    2000 GTP: XP, P&P'd Heads, N*\Lq4 MAF, GenV, 42#'s, PRJ Rails\FPR, Racetronix, TEP w/ 3.29 Gears, 300m, 7/8" chain, SSAC's. - Collecting dust in my garage.
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  3. #3 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    Florida Tuner Z34Phoenix's Avatar
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    ^ is correct. you can not just add fuel to the MAF and get it to be rich or leaner. as the trims will just put things back the way they were. you need to command more or less fuel.

    96 Z34 (RIP LQ1 14.81@92.3) L36 Swap 14.9@91.5 www.cardomain.com/id/z34phoenix
    Topswap: P&P All,Si Valves,L76's,LW Pushrods,SD's,DHP PT PB 13.91@99.8
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  4. #4 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    ok AFR vs ECT is at 11.6-11.7 and Offset vs volts im lost there lol
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  5. #5 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    GXP Level Member 91parkave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackgrandprix View Post
    ok AFR vs ECT is at 11.6-11.7 and Offset vs volts im lost there lol
    Look under engine-fuel-general
    You need to what was suggested in earlier post look up all the tables and apply them into your tune and then recalibrate your maf table
    06 GXP | 222/227 cam/cartuning turbo kit on 8psi/meth/e85 coilovers/ still on stock trans at 130k
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  6. #6 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    I AM PEWPIN! rynoman03's Avatar
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    So basically you put in your injectors and just hoped they worked and you would be ok?!?! Ya... You need to adj your pcm to command less fuel. Those 60# ers put out way more than your stockers. You need to go find the tables that need applied like i mentioned above. Then go drive your car for 15-25 min while scanning and adj your maf. Your fuel trims are probably way the f off right now. Also why are you so lean on your AFR vs ECT. That's not gonna make one hoot of diff until you get the right injector tables applied. IE under Flow vs KPA then Offset vs volts.

    Go look under engine then fuel my friend. Or what brand of 60# injectors do you have. Maybe I can do some googling for you and try to find the tables. Have you made an acct on HP Tuners forum yet or even tried to find the tables for your injectors?
    1999 GTPHP Tuned, Ported SC/TB, 42#'s, SSAC's, ZZP Modded 1.9's/LS6 Springs/Manley's, TransGo Shift Kit, Poly Uppers, KYB GR2's/Springtech's. - 231k and traded it in. - Gone
    2000 GTP: XP, P&P'd Heads, N*\Lq4 MAF, GenV, 42#'s, PRJ Rails\FPR, Racetronix, TEP w/ 3.29 Gears, 300m, 7/8" chain, SSAC's. - Collecting dust in my garage.
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  7. #7 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    Quote Originally Posted by rynoman03 View Post
    So basically you put in your injectors and just hoped they worked and you would be ok?!?! Ya... You need to adj your pcm to command less fuel. Those 60# ers put out way more than your stockers. You need to go find the tables that need applied like i mentioned above. Then go drive your car for 15-25 min while scanning and adj your maf. Your fuel trims are probably way the f off right now. Also why are you so lean on your AFR vs ECT. That's not gonna make one hoot of diff until you get the right injector tables applied. IE under Flow vs KPA then Offset vs volts.

    Go look under engine then fuel my friend. Or what brand of 60# injectors do you have. Maybe I can do some googling for you and try to find the tables. Have you made an acct on HP Tuners forum yet or even tried to find the tables for your injectors?
    You sound mad at the guy... And you're giving him poor info.
    Blackgp, all you need is to get your IFR (injector flow rate) right then put your other fueling tables back to stock and you'll be all set to tune from there. Don't touch your stock MAF table. You will likely do more harm than good.
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  8. #8 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil99gp View Post
    Don't touch your stock MAF table. You will likely do more harm than good.
    WHAT???

    Put in the 60LB IFR table, and then use the wideband to tune the MAF. This is how i have done every 3800, and i get the AFR spot on
    2003 SSEi,
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  9. #9 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003 SSEi View Post
    WHAT???

    Put in the 60LB IFR table, and then use the wideband to tune the MAF. This is how i have done every 3800, and i get the AFR spot on
    Every professional in the business uses a stock MAF table for your specific MAF sensor.
    It's an interesting phenomenon that people with basically stock setups tune their MAF curves.
    As long as the injector flow rate is correct there will be no need to tune the MAF.
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  10. #10 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    LOL

    Guess the Professionals missed this then
    How to tune in your fuel trims with HPTuners | ZZP News

    http://www.trafficjams.ca/Performanc...cs/MAFTune.htm

    http://www.turbov6camaro.com/maf.htm

    http://www.fullthrottlev6.com/forums...m_garys_tuning

    In our test case, the Mass Air Flow sensor is causing the rich condition, denoted by all of the negative LTFT's. We already KNOW FOR SURE that the VE table is correct, after all it is the backup to the MAF. What we need to do now is re-calibrate the MAF table using these values. Lets take for example cell number 3200 X .8 which has a value of 17. In our scans in SD Mode we have a value of -1. What is the difference in %? Good question! There is no equation that will accurately calculate it. We know that this vehicle is running rich. We know that by reducing the MAF table (called scaling it) we will cause the MAF to be Calibrated to the right values. The trick is to discover where the MAF curve needs to be set at. This is a painful process, but there is currently no other way. It is very obvious that we are running rich in this example, by a pretty steady amount right? Well, lets look at the MAF table breakdown, and decide what we need to do.
    Our cars dont use VE like other PCM/ECM's
    Last edited by 2003 SSEi; 06-01-2013 at 10:15 AM.
    2003 SSEi,
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  11. #11 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    GXP Level Member 91parkave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil99gp View Post
    Every professional in the business uses a stock MAF table for your specific MAF sensor.
    It's an interesting phenomenon that people with basically stock setups tune their MAF curves.
    As long as the injector flow rate is correct there will be no need to tune the MAF.
    Are you trolling from clubgp.?

    Lol .....no you use a stock maf table as a starting point sure but the stock maf table is far from being accurate for each car and its upgrades. I can't think of why you wouldn't want to use all tools available to you to accurately tune your vehicle.
    06 GXP | 222/227 cam/cartuning turbo kit on 8psi/meth/e85 coilovers/ still on stock trans at 130k
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  12. #12 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    I AM PEWPIN! rynoman03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil99gp View Post
    You sound mad at the guy... And you're giving him poor info.
    Blackgp, all you need is to get your IFR (injector flow rate) right then put your other fueling tables back to stock and you'll be all set to tune from there. Don't touch your stock MAF table. You will likely do more harm than good.
    Not mad, just saying you gotta change stuff in your pcm to run bigger injectors. It just sounds like he put them in and ran with it then wondered why he was rich. I tune my MAF as do others. If you want to leave yours stock than that is your choice. I didn't think that I gave him any false or poor info.
    1999 GTPHP Tuned, Ported SC/TB, 42#'s, SSAC's, ZZP Modded 1.9's/LS6 Springs/Manley's, TransGo Shift Kit, Poly Uppers, KYB GR2's/Springtech's. - 231k and traded it in. - Gone
    2000 GTP: XP, P&P'd Heads, N*\Lq4 MAF, GenV, 42#'s, PRJ Rails\FPR, Racetronix, TEP w/ 3.29 Gears, 300m, 7/8" chain, SSAC's. - Collecting dust in my garage.
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  13. #13 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    youtu.be/xhrBDcQq2DM FoSHO99's Avatar
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    You need to read some more before you do **** like this.
    2001 GTP PT61 Turbo, E85, Stock Motor
    2011 Chevy Cruze MT6 1.4L Turbo
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  14. #14 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
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    If you guys would have read or even looked at things you would have noticed the IFR has been changed and the afr vs ect has also been changed. I'm confused with off set vs volts. And to find the IFR I used stock injector divide ide by new , and then multiplied stock IFR by the number. So i should not change Maf just the IFR table to get afr close then just very fine tune from Maf ??
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  15. #15 Re: Injector help/Look at my tune 
    GXP Level Member 91parkave's Avatar
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    How to tune 60lb injectors - 56k = ZZzzzzz...
    BTW Tue your maf its more accurate of course only after you get your injector data right
    Last edited by 91parkave; 06-02-2013 at 02:31 AM.
    06 GXP | 222/227 cam/cartuning turbo kit on 8psi/meth/e85 coilovers/ still on stock trans at 130k
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