Neat stuff. My brother who has a deisel was telling me not to long ago how to make your own Bio Deisel. Sounds like pretty much the same setup as this.
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08-29-2008
Neat stuff. My brother who has a deisel was telling me not to long ago how to make your own Bio Deisel. Sounds like pretty much the same setup as this.
08-29-2008
yea one of my former schoolmates bought a diesel truck and runs it on vegetable oil. He has a setup to filter out the oil from the restauraunts he gets it from. Were can I find more info about an e85 conversion for the GP?
08-29-2008
honestly from all the reading ive done you pretty much only need bigger injectors and a tune. im going to be doing a whole mess of stuff at once, so itll be fun tuning it...not.
08-29-2008
If it's that easy, why don't I just change my AFR to 9.0:1 and I'll have more power!Originally Posted by Bio248
You have to get sufficient air in with that 40% increase in fuel. Which means you need even MORE airflow mods to be at the same point.
08-29-2008
airflow?....is that not what the charger is for? increased air flow?....and its not had to convert...just a big tune and injectors...if its a weekend toy and or track car i would think it would be great! high octane, cooler temps...cant argue with that...and yes, 1 oz. of gas has more "power" than 1 oz. of E85 hense the 30-40% more fuel...i am concidering doing this to my firebird eentually too
08-29-2008
Am I speaking a different language? If the supercharger could provide plenty of airflow, what's the point of headers, rockers/cam, throttle bodies, etc.
Take one supercharged car running on gasoline. Another right next to it is running on E85. To dyno about the same, the E85 car would have to dump ~40% more fuel and pull in ~40% more air to match the gasoline car due to the drastically lower amount of energy contained in E85. If a 40% increase in airflow is easy, excuse me...
There's physics and facts, and then there's what people want to believe. Choose which you want to be in on.
Last edited by Sabrewings; 08-29-2008 at 04:14 PM.
08-29-2008
wow sorry i seem to have struck a nerve...the main reason i think he want to convert is the 105 rating and cooler charge...thus reducing kr and allowing more timing advance...
08-29-2008
But at the same time you're introducing a weaker fuel, which negates the gains and probably gives you a deficit.
It's not that a nerve was struck, just that I'm tired of saying the same things over and over again. Either no one understands or no one is listening. Let people do it if they want to throw away their money...
08-29-2008
Getting enough air doesn't seem to be a problem for anyone. That said, as far as the 3.8, go over to clubgp and search for E85 in the General Section, by author Ron Vogel before a month ago. You will find a lot of first hand information.
08-30-2008
I thought this was a very informative read. Converting to E85 (ethanol fuel) - Turbobricks Forums
08-30-2008
So what I got out of reading that was that Bio248, Sabrewings, and riceburner are all right and maybe a little wrong, but not really.
There were other ways than this but I liked this one the best!
1. the bigger injectors, frpe82 adviced this formula "Calculating useable injector size:
(CURRENT INJECTOR SIZE x 1.39) up to (CURRENT INJECTOR SIZE x 1.6)"
"To get a satisfying injector flow on stock injectors, you will probably have to go to 5.5bar (80psi) or more..." - frpe82
2. an adjustable FPR that flows 40% more than our stock one (people who only want economical gains) or 60% (people that want performance as well), and a mounting bracket
3. An upgraded fuel pump (luckily for me i have 4 or 5 Walbro 255lph lying around from the Talon...)
4. You'll need 30-35" new soft fuel lines, 20-25" vacuum hose, t-junction, hose clamps
As for supporting mods frpe82 didn't say much. I kind of got out of it that if you are only doing it for economical purposes and not modifying your car for a lot more power then you should be fine with the basic setup (40% upgraded flow from the FPR). However, he was running a turbocharged volvo. My judgement on this is that with the basic setup, without high modification to the vehicle, the Supercharged models would be ok. I don't know how the N/A guys would handle.
Did someone mention that the LSx guys were doing this? Maybe they'd be better help for the N/A aspect of proper airflow.
If you have more modifications, headers, more forced induction, etc.., then you should probably run a FPR with a 50-60% higher flow.
NOTE!!!: He mentioned that this can cost a lot of money if our ecu's need reflashed/programmed etc. just to put the setup in and just as much money if we decide we don't want the setup later on down the road.
He explains in great details why HIS ecu didn't need to be reflashed but he did anyway for better fuel mileage.
The article was great and very well wrote. He explains stuff in moderate detail but nothing you can't google to understand further.
I am pretty positive I'm leaning towards this modification. I've already begun to fermentate some chopped corn. (I've been making wine for about a year and a half now so I had the supplies)
I am going to agree with Sabrewings. It is probably a really good idea to get a good amount of supporting airflow mods before converting just to be on the safe side.
Wish me luck!
09-01-2008
anyone else agree or have anything to comment on this?
09-01-2008
from what ive been reading, the swap isnt much more than bigger injectors and a tune. ive already bought 65# injectors, so im gearing up for the change over. with this im going to be putting in a wideband and a happy knob so i can screw with my fueling and timing a little more in depth.
the point of this is to be able to run a lot higher octane at the expense of using more fuel. downsides? you use more fuel. up sides? 105 octane, so increased boost and timing to go with it.
im going to end up letting you guys know what happens..a local guy around here ran a 3.0 on a car with a ported blower and ported exhaust mani's, so im thinking this is going to give me a huge gain.
09-01-2008
Let me know how it goes Bio! I'm probably going to get a new FPR, Injectors and maybe some supporting mods. I have a Walbro 255lph High Pressure so might as well install it. Only thing I'm worried about is the right voltage for the pump, I had to re-wire to the pump in the Talon.
Question: What is the size of our stock fuel injectors??? Do they flow 360cc??? I'm thinking 500-600cc would be pretty sufficient for running the ethanol.
09-01-2008
zzp tuned my car on e85 at 13.8 i have a 255 rewire 65lb stg2 volt booster
09-02-2008
Thank you Kev! Huge help!
09-02-2008
im going to be using my stock fuel pump with a re-wire, so it should run around 14V, a little less.
otherwise the injectors im using are 65#, which is ~630cc if im not mistaken..
09-02-2008
So you are running e85 now? How do you like it? Pros and cons?
09-03-2008
i did the zzp hotwire kit 3 years ago and just asumed i was geting 15 volts at the pump (i get 15.3 at the alt)anyways i checked it the otherday at the pump and it was at 12 volts so i aded a relay now i get 14.9 at the pump
09-03-2008
yes still on e85 it does give more power its cheaper easy to get
the bad 16mpg on a road tripe cant read the plugs worth a ****
ass much as i drive it i should have went with 110
i wouldent recomend e85 fore a dd 16mpg sucks
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