Thread: Hard startup and noise

Alright, so this just started today.... When I start the car, it seems like it just doesn't want to start. It makes a loud ch ch ch noise and doesn't start up right away. However, after 2 or 3 turns it starts up. Once it starts, it runs perfectly fine.

It only happens when I start 'er up. Anyone know why this noise is happening or what is the source? thanks.

I'm guessing starter? where is it located in a 97 gtp, and are there any write ups? where to buy also? any info appreciated. thanks

I assume the 97 is like all other 3800s and if so the start is up front, held in by two bolts and should be fairly easy to change. Its up there on the opposite side of the AC compressor.

Just went outside and searched for it.... even asked my dad to take a look... we're clueless. haha. I see AC compressor, but no starter anywhere on the opposite side, or anywhere in the front of the engine for that matter.

Should I be able to see it looking down into the engine? Any diagrams of wiring it also? I'd like to get this fixed sometime this week while I'm off of school and work. Thanks.

If you can see the AC compressor, just turn your head to the other end of the engine (drivers side) and you should see the starter. AC compressor is on the front of the engine, passenger side. Starter is on the front side of the engine, drivers side.

Scotty, I must be losing my head.

I look on the passenger side, there's the AC compressor (covered in oil) that is hooked up to the pulley... then I turn my head and I see a PCM on the drivers side. Is it near the PCM at all? Sorry, I just have no idea.

I'm looking on the drivers side straight down, right next to my CAI/PCM... where in relation is it to that?

Well theres the problem, I was assuming you were looking at it from underneath, which is where you will need to be to see it clearly. Though I can see mine from the top, but I can see where it would be difficult to see from the top side.

What is underneath your CAI is your tranny bell housing. See where that drivers side upper motor mount is. Look straight down from there, maybe just a touch to the left of it. But you would be able to see it easier from the bottom.

Well, bell housing is not entirely correct, its the side cover rather. Sorry about that.

Alright I jacked 'er up and saw exactly what I need to do. I took a picture - so all I need to do is remove those two bolts that I circled? And then how do I re-wire it?



I'm going to try to replace it this week.... where should I buy one? also - any advice from people who have done it before would be much appreciated. I'm pretty much a noob , so any help would be great!

Can anyone do a little write-up for me about how to replace a starter?

I'm ordering one from Ed Morad.... not too shabby of a deal - $44.00

a quick run down would be greatly appreciated, and worth some reputation

Well its really straight forward actually.

-Disconnect your battery, fail to do so at your own peril. One of the battery leads goes to the starter. If you report back you made sparks, I'll laugh at you for weeks.

-Remove the two starter bolts, they are long winded ones too, I dont remember what size they are though.

-Pull the starter free, but be careful as there are wires attached.

-What I would do then is just disconnect the wires one at a time and transfer to the new starter so you dont get them connected wrong. Make sure that the wires from one stud arent touching the others, especially the battery lead.

-Reinstall new starter

-Reconnect battery.

Just a side note, long crank times and hard starts are often the signs of a bad FPR. Take the vac line off your FPR and smell it. If you smell gas then your FPR is leaking.

Synthetic- thanks a lot for the quick write up. I'll def have to install it. Should I just connect the wires or do I have to sauder them? Also - I tried giving you rep, but I need to 'spread it around first.' you'll get it one of these days! lol.

Sabre - I'm pretty sure its my starter because it doesn't really need to be cranked. It starts fairly well, just with a god awful screech noise. I did check the FPR tho, no fuel drainage or scent. Thanks tho!

Originally Posted by GreenNirvana101

Alright I jacked 'er up and saw exactly what I need to do. I took a picture - so all I need to do is remove those two bolts that I circled? And then how do I re-wire it?



I'm going to try to replace it this week.... where should I buy one? also - any advice from people who have done it before would be much appreciated. I'm pretty much a noob , so any help would be great!

Scott- you cant see it from here, but on the upper side of the starter is the solenoid. it has a positive/negative wire that can be disconnected by removing a nut(much like your alternator). Like Scotty had said...make sure you get them back on the right stud.....and that they DONT touch.

there is no need to solder anything. I will give you a call today. just need to remove that plastic cover, remove 2 bolts, drop it down, remove 2 wires, put wires on new starter, put new starter up to bell housing, put 2 bolts back in. process is easy...just take your time.

Alright - well today I was planning on replacing the starter, but ran into a few problems after taking it out and realizing its different than the one I got from Ed Morad.

First off, I took out my core and brought it into advance auto to test it... it worked great, no problems at all. Advance said it should be fine, but they also said the one that I got from Morad was a different model as it was much shorter and looked a little different (Working on getting a refund from Morad).

Advance said that the starter I have now should be fine... but it may need some shims? I bought a set of shims and tried my best trying a few different sizes (1/64, 1/32, 1/16).... it sounded better, but still was grinding/whining at startup....

Can anyone tell me why I would still be getting this grinding noise? Has anyone used shims before on a GP? It says the starter doesn't need it... but idk. Any advice would be great! Thanks.

Did you try taking off the TC inspection cover and rotating the crank to inspect the flex plate? Maybe there is some damage to the teeth...

there doesn't look like any damage to the teeth on the flywheel or the starter... but if I don't fix it... I'm guessing the grinding will end up damaging it...

Are we supposed to use shims on these starters? Also - would a bad lower motor mount have any effect on this situation?

I havent used a shim on a 3800....

my "guess" is that the starting gear is not retracting back into the housing. the grinding you are hearing is from the flexplate and the starter gear still inter twined......

this is my best guess....without actually hearing it.

Well... I installed the remanufactured starter without any shims or anything - and it started up great without any noise.... so I just left it.

I used my old starter as the core... and I guess I'll just return the starter I bought from Ed Morad... hopefully he will understand if I pay the shipping back for it.... or maybe I'll just get a store credit or something...

Did anybody know what starter I got from Morad? It looks very similar... but is smaller and shorter in length...

Thanks to everyone for helping me out.

Originally Posted by GreenNirvana101

Well... I installed the remanufactured starter without any shims or anything - and it started up great without any noise.... so I just left it.

I used my old starter as the core... and I guess I'll just return the starter I bought from Ed Morad... hopefully he will understand if I pay the shipping back for it.... or maybe I'll just get a store credit or something...

Did anybody know what starter I got from Morad? It looks very similar... but is smaller and shorter in length...

Thanks to everyone for helping me out.

I would suspect that the starter on your 97 is the original starter. And later in years, maybe up into 05 or 06 they made them smaller. But I trust, coming from Ed, that starter would work for your car. Maybe not the same size overall. But I would bet that it would bolt up the same. Have the same connections. Have the same teeth. And work perfectly. I actually have no doubts that is the case.

Also, I wouldn't trust a remanufactured starter. I have had too many problems with things like this from aftermarket parts stores. I would put an original GM starter (or any other parts for that matter) from Ed on anyday of the week.