L67 mild mods

this simple fact hit my original home forum (mymonte.com which was mainly 5th gen montes) years ago ... as our cars get older they get cheaper... as they get cheaper we get more kids and flaky people buying them. you know the ones that buy the ebay chip for 30HP and turbonator, and electric turbos. or put the 3.2" pulley on a stock GTP and wonder why it went boom on the highway! (thanks who ever that was cause i made good money parting out your mistake) but yes it is sad to use long term people who really care about these cars.

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Originally Posted by slick2500

Ok, first off the spacebar is your friend and so are paragraphs.
Second you can not safely run a 3.5 pulley on stock exhaust manifolds you don't have enough flow, let alone a 3.4. And the cats on these cars do not restrict the exhaust flow unless they are clogged.

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Not true regarding the 3.5. GTXs have a 3.5 pulley and nothing else. I ran a 3.4 for years with just an intake and 3" dp and a zzp pcm. It really just depends on where you live. Also the stock catback is good up until like 400 whp, so unless you just want to change the sound you dont have to worry about that. Please stop posting slick.

I understand it can be overwhelming. The inherent problem is that 3800s act different depending where you live amongst other things. . Like someone stated earlier, headers are cheap as hell now. I remember paying 500+ for TOGs and they didnt have as big of primaries as the ebay ones you can get now. Get a set of headers and a 3.4. Thats a 250 dollar investment. If you want to be safe and have no one to tune get a pcm from zzp for 125. Now youre 375 into it and will have a nice safe bump in power. Unless the person is tuning for free I wouldnt waste the time or money unless you were going to go below a 3.4 pulley with custom tuning. Get some kind of scanner as well, you always want to know whats going on with your car.

EDIT: That list that wbody store put can be had for less than 500 bucks.

I read the safe mod info but then you go to Wbody and they tell you you can run a 3.4 with a downpipe only and the questions start.I planned on having someone flash the PCM you say zzp is 125 what about the rest?I figured a 160 stat was better i live in michigan i wont drive the car in the winterI know the PCM has to be tuned for either thermostat.Yeah the headers are a good deal but like i said i doubt i could get 3 inch under the car i figured a true 2.5 from the manifolds out would flow pretty decent for the mild mods i am doing.I will run atleast 93 octane.We have a 3500.00 Snap On Solus scanner so i will be able to check the KR.

Guy, that's because vendors are out to make money, not to give you the correct information.

Read that thread, disregard ZZP or other vendors "X mod is required for Y pulley crap".

And "true three inch"?

Catless headers with a 3" downpipe...stock catback. Stock catback is good for 350 FWHP...which you are NO where close to. And snap on scanners last I checked can't scan or log in motion...just scan at idle...and KR won't register in park when there is no load on the motor just revving it.

Like I said...you would have known that if you read that thread.

You can run a 3.4 with a downpipe only. But IMO safely to do it I would at least get a zzp 1.0 pcm and a 180 degree thermostat. With the zzp 1.0 pcm they send you a pcm and you just plug it in, nothing else is needed.I would never run a 160 because the car will never get warm enough to go into closed loop mode plus it can throw a CEL. Its not needed. Also you do not need a 3" exhuast. The headers will bolt to your stock catback. I would not waste the time on running true duals. All youre doing is adding weight with no gains. The stock cat back flows good enought up to 400 whp. You will be nowhere near that with the mods youre doing.

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Originally Posted by t24moore

You can run a 3.4 with a downpipe only. But IMO safely to do it I would at least get a zzp 1.0 pcm and a 180 degree thermostat. With the zzp 1.0 pcm they send you a pcm and you just plug it in, nothing else is needed.I would never run a 160 because the car will never get warm enough to go into closed loop mode plus it can throw a CEL. Its not needed. Also you do not need a 3" exhuast. The headers will bolt to your stock catback. I would not waste the time on running true duals. All youre doing is adding weight with no gains. The stock cat back flows good enought up to 400 whp. You will be nowhere near that with the mods youre doing.

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Not really, this is where the discrepancies lie.

Can you run a 3.4" with plugs/t-stat/canned PCM/downpipe? Sure.

Can ALL cars? Not in any reality.

Most of these cars are getting older...and can't handle what they could off the showroom floor 10+ years ago.

Infact, many people here still get knock with headers and a 3.4"...and a CUSTOM wideband tune...

Which is why I say...valvetrain mods are key...and a tune > pulley envy; I'd run a stock pulley with headers and a leaner AFR + higher timing and running a piggy AFR and stock timing or less with a 3.4".

That's the main reason behind my Safely Modding thread. It points people in the SAFE direction, not like all the vendors that just say (Let's take ZZP for example)..."BUY OUR STAGE 1 OR 2 OR 3 PACKAGES AND GO SUPER FAST WITHOUT SCANNING THE CAR".

First things first should be maintenence.

Second, a way to scan the car...ALA tuner...or aeroforce.

Third, address the exhaust issues...you want to get rid of: AT THE LEAST the crappy front manifold, downpipe, and the u-bend...which can be easily done with a cheap set of headers...which are about, if not less than the price of a downpipe now days.

Fourth, then think about a pulley system...like an MPS...try a 3.6", then a 3.4"...then if that works for you...then re-tune for it...buy a wideband...make it spot on...

Tossing crap on a car and hoping for the best isn't the best route to go about it.

I read that thread you wrote but as ive said numerous times when you read Wbody it is conflicting i believe they do want to sell you the parts i agree.It doesnt seem like they would tell you something that would blow your engine but that is why i have asked the questions i have here.I was saying the headers dump to 3 in i doubt i could get 3 in under the car easily it would fight me and have low spots etc .Headers and 2.5 would be a lot better than 2.5 off the manifolds.I THINK if i open up the stock flange to 2.5 and run it all the way out it will flow pretty good or good enough for 3.4 .I know this isnt going to make any friends here but i have a very hard time believing removing that cat gives you nothing I have put a CAI and removed the cat on various vehicles that where NA and had huge gains none dyno tested.

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Originally Posted by bluegtp91

Not really, this is where the discrepancies lie.

Can you run a 3.4" with plugs/t-stat/canned PCM/downpipe? Sure.

Can ALL cars? Not in any reality.

Most of these cars are getting older...and can't handle what they could off the showroom floor 10+ years ago.

Infact, many people here still get knock with headers and a 3.4"...and a CUSTOM wideband tune...

Which is why I say...valvetrain mods are key...and a tune > pulley envy; I'd run a stock pulley with headers and a leaner AFR + higher timing and running a piggy AFR and stock timing or less with a 3.4".

That's the main reason behind my Safely Modding thread. It points people in the SAFE direction, not like all the vendors that just say (Let's take ZZP for example)..."BUY OUR STAGE 1 OR 2 OR 3 PACKAGES AND GO SUPER FAST WITHOUT SCANNING THE CAR".

First things first should be maintenence.

Second, a way to scan the car...ALA tuner...or aeroforce.

Third, address the exhaust issues...you want to get rid of: AT THE LEAST the crappy front manifold, downpipe, and the u-bend...which can be easily done with a cheap set of headers...which are about, if not less than the price of a downpipe now days.

Fourth, then think about a pulley system...like an MPS...try a 3.6", then a 3.4"...then if that works for you...then re-tune for it...buy a wideband...make it spot on...

Tossing crap on a car and hoping for the best isn't the best route to go about it.

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I forget that a lot of people have motors that have upwards of 160+ miles nowadays. I swapped my motor for a newer L32 with 50k. Thats a sound order you listed there.

I agree with you thats why i am asking what i am before i order anything.Thanks for all the input guys!

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Originally Posted by jsnyder49090

I read that thread you wrote but as ive said numerous times when you read Wbody it is conflicting i believe they do want to sell you the parts i agree.It doesnt seem like they would tell you something that would blow your engine but that is why i have asked the questions i have here.I was saying the headers dump to 3 in i doubt i could get 3 in under the car easily it would fight me and have low spots etc .Headers and 2.5 would be a lot better than 2.5 off the manifolds.I THINK if i open up the stock flange to 2.5 and run it all the way out it will flow pretty good or good enough for 3.4 .I know this isnt going to make any friends here but i have a very hard time believing removing that cat gives you nothing I have put a CAI and removed the cat on various vehicles that where NA and had huge gains none dyno tested.

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The problem is that you dont significantly gain anything because you are not changing the valvetrain so youre still going to start boost stacking when you increase boost. The U bend is more of a restriction than the stock cat. If you want to remove it thats fine. No one is telling you not to. But in the end anything after the cat doesnt need to be touched. NA cars are different than boosted cars. If you really want to do it the right way get some rockers at least. if youre trying to stay within a budget follow what blue said IMO.

Does the factory exhaust have a flex tube in it? as much as the mounts move i would think it would be a good idea ? The engine has around 100,000 i ran a compression test all cyl where around 180 the oil is fairly clean and the oil filler looks very good the rockers or rocker i am able to see looks very clean.I am buying plugs,wires,fuel filter,i have a trans filter kit already the brakes will be checked any loose components in the front end will be replaced.I plan to run a high detergent 10w30 for 500-1000 miles see if it needs it again and likely go to 5w30 maybe syn or Defy not sure yet.I will be flushing the cooling system replacing the thermostat with a 180 (thanks guys).Installing a trans go kit and upgrading the fluid as well.

Defy doesn't have an API star burst on it. Based on that I would never run that in anything.

Run Pennzoil for cleaning.

Factory has a flex, all aftermarket solutions have flex sections.

Factory flex is located right after the rear manifold/o2 sensor at the top of the downpipe...it's not that great, I've seen plenty of them crack open due to stress from failed factory motor/transmission mounts.

I will have to add a flex to whatever i build thanks guys the Defy is basically Quaker State HM with some added zinc it has about a 1000 ppm of zinc thats why no API logo i believe.I know my engine has a roller cam but i cant help to believe it is a little extra insurance.All the racing oils have it, i joined this site BITOG Bob Is The Oil Guy a lot of good reading guys.i know we all want whats best for our cars/engines and i have learned a bunch on that site.It also gives you tips and rebates etc etc. I paid 20.99 Per oil change Valvoline NextGen 5qt jug with a filter and will get a 20.00 auto zone card back, 2 of them actually cause there was a limit of 2.I also bought 2 5qt jugs of peak oil at True Value for 24.99 and will get 20 bucks back.You guys should check it out any oil you use someone has sent it in for testing and it will tell you what your really running in your engine.

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Originally Posted by t24moore

Not true regarding the 3.5. GTXs have a 3.5 pulley and nothing else. I ran a 3.4 for years with just an intake and 3" dp and a zzp pcm. It really just depends on where you live. Also the stock catback is good up until like 400 whp, so unless you just want to change the sound you dont have to worry about that. Please stop posting slick.

I understand it can be overwhelming. The inherent problem is that 3800s act different depending where you live amongst other things. . Like someone stated earlier, headers are cheap as hell now. I remember paying 500+ for TOGs and they didnt have as big of primaries as the ebay ones you can get now. Get a set of headers and a 3.4. Thats a 250 dollar investment. If you want to be safe and have no one to tune get a pcm from zzp for 125. Now youre 375 into it and will have a nice safe bump in power. Unless the person is tuning for free I wouldnt waste the time or money unless you were going to go below a 3.4 pulley with custom tuning. Get some kind of scanner as well, you always want to know whats going on with your car.

EDIT: That list that wbody store put can be had for less than 500 bucks.

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**** you, I'm trying to help this guy from blowing his **** up but whatever. Evidently your the super 3800 guru..............asshole. And btw the GTX's with the 3.5 pulley had roller rockers and headers you tool.

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Originally Posted by slick2500

**** you, I'm trying to help this guy from blowing his **** up but whatever. Evidently your the super 3800 guru..............asshole. And btw the GTX's with the 3.5 pulley had roller rockers and headers you tool.

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says the guy with two chipped pistons lol

Yeah I didn't chip them, you can see they had been chipped for quite some time from the carbon buildup.

LOL FYI I have NEVER chipped a piston while youre calling names child. I bet I have modified way more 3800s than you ever will, been doing this for 7 years now and have had every mod under the sun except nitrous as well as built setups for various people. What I post is what I have seen from experience over the years of building these things. You can try to act like youre a big shot here but what gives you that right? Whats done to that POS car of yours except two chipped pistions in which a retarded kid can change out? Im just trying to help the OP without sounding condescending like yourself. Have fun with your Hyundai Accent, that fits you more.

And now the thread has degraded into whos is bigger as they always do....

/unsubscribe

So your one of the lucky few people that have never chipped a piston... I'll believe that when my **** turns purple and smells like rainbow sherbet. Who gives a **** what you've built and who you've built it for, you have no right to come here and tell people to shut up for no reason other than be an asshole. And I'm not acting like a big shot I'm just trying to help out someone who from what I read was pretty much ignoring what we were telling him to do for almost 2 pages. If I'm condescending its because there are already how many millions of threads on this exact subject where the op continued to ignore what people were telling him and/or her. I understand people have questions but is reading really that hard? No its not. I spend hours a day on here reading and learning while I'm bored or whatever so everything I have learned I have learned from the community, and yes replacing the pistons in an engine is easy do I have the money to replace everything right now? No I don't. Its also cheaper to just go out and buy a used engine from even a junk yard than it is to rebuild. So that is why my car is parked and I'm driving an Accent.
You go ahead and do whatever the **** you want now I don't care I'm done.............