Got A Dilema, Which Engine Support

[SyntheticShield]

Okay. My tranny is getting a little worse and Im not sure its going to make it to Trannyman. My initial plan was to rebuild it myself for the experience and education factor but I think Im running out of time.

I have a spare tranny (All I have done to is is pull the side cover, and I took out the differential and consequently the output shaft, other than that its fully in tack) that was reported as being a working tranny when I bought it.

So Im looking at possibly having to pull my current tranny out and putting the spare one in, in hopes it will buy me some time. The problem I face is doing the work, which requires an engine support, is which one to get. I searched eBay and came up with the following:

1. eBay Motors: Astro Pneumatic Transverse Engine Support Bar 31"-64" (item 360018723868 end time Feb-05-08 16:59:06 PST)

2. eBay Motors: Engine Transverse Bar with Arm Support (item 280193659121 end time Feb-17-08 14:32:17 PST)

3. eBay Motors: 1100# Automotive Transverse Engine Gearbox Support Bar (item 260208620564 end time Feb-04-08 15:43:39 PST)


Number one and two appear to be essentially the same thing and support 700#'s each. The third supports 1100# but I would need two of them. I dont believe the engine would weigh in at 700#'s but I guess I would like to be sure and find out what your thoughts are on which support would be the better choice.

I have watched #3 for a long time because in the back of my mind is that it would be able to support both engine and tranny should I ever want to do something like change out the cradle (which has been a consideration)

I had this big long list of modifications I was going to do when the tranny was yanked, including replacing the timing chain, valve train upgrades, brake and fuel upgrades, ported blower, etc. But the tranny making a turn for the worse has cut my time table short. As well I was wanting to take an out of state vacation this year and I definitely want a reliable tranny.

I would like to, at a minimum, get the timing chain replaced with the tranny out but I gotta figure out first how to get the tranny out.

So what do all of you think? Which of the supports is going to be the better choice and why? Tips and ideas welcome too on yanking the tranny.

[59chevy]

engine supports are nice , now play nice and dont call me a hack or a shade tree but i just used a piece of 1 1/2 pipe and two ratchet straps . didnt have any problems and it held everything in place for a couple of weeks. if i planned on doing it often then i would probably spring for the support.

the trans wasnt that bad to get out , the first time i did mine i had it on the floor in about 3-4 hours , worst part would have been the bolt on the firewall side of the block all the way at the bottom. call me lucky but when whoever did the motor for the previous owner they left that pia out. its in now but what a pain kinda. alot easier than i thoguth it would be. air tools are a must for this job in my opinion.

[SyntheticShield]

Well I had thought of some ideas like that, but was kinda concerned about the ability to hold things up for long term if needed. But now that you have mentioned your using it, a couple new ideas popped in my head I may have to look at. What kind of pipe did you use, just regular steel pipe?

I guess the major part of removing the tranny is removing the axles, the strut and mount, correct. Did you drop out the cradle too? If so, where do I find those round bushings at the mounting points for the cradle?

I got some how to's on dropping out the tranny and a friend of mine just recently gave me a socket extension that is literally three feet long. 1/2" drive, but three feet long nonetheless. But I assume the major part of dropping out the tranny are the bell housing bolts and then supporting it and getting back up in there, correct?

[Toasty]

maybe not the best solution, but on both my gtp and my GS, my brother inlaw and i had a piece of 2" square tubing, put a few holes in it for some chain to hang the motor from, welded a few 3/4" pipes on the sides to sit in the edge of the fender/body and went that way.... did end up having to put a slight bend/hump in the square tubing to clear some stuff in the engine bay (dont remember what now) but they were parts we had handy... if you dont have parts handy, getting a tool might not be a bad idea.

[SyntheticShield]

Im thinking I may have some good ideas thanks to 59chevy's post, but square tubing would be easier to work with in the long run. Is there need for an impact wrench or any type of air tools?

[59chevy]

i just used a piece of 1 1/2 steel pipe , like plumbing pipe , it was that or a 4x4 oiece of wood from pass strut tower to the lf core support, worked like a dream, also wrapped the ends in towles as not to slip or damadge paint.
craddle out is a must i do believe ,at least i took mine out.
i did it in this order
jack stands on rocker
tires off
struts out
pulled spindles all the way out (tied up calipers)
unbolted rack from frame
supported engine with pipe and straps
removed all lines and wires clipped to craddle
unbolted front mount and trans mount
lifted engine just enough to raise it off the craddle
took out l/f r/r craddle bolts
double checked for anything i missed
put another pait of stand under craddle and took remaining bolts out so the craddle would rest on other stands.
craddle out
disconnect shifter cable, wiring , and trans lines(should have done earlier , motor and trans wanted to rock around pretty good).
jack under trans pan
remove torque converter bolts
remove bell housing bolts
lowered jack and trans was out
like i said it was my first w bodt trans r&r but out in 3-4 hours with many cig breaks , in about the same , alittle quicker.

[59chevy]

it could probably be done with out , im spoiled and always used them. i would highly recommend using air tool , strut bolts and rack bolts would be a bear with out , also makes torque converter bolts easier , no need to hold the motor from spinning over.

as for the round pipe , yeah square would be nicer ...... but in the heat of the battle i grab what i can....lol

[Zef_66]

I did the shade tree things as well when I changed my oil pan gasket. And doing this requires the engine not only to be supported, but lifted 6-8". I used a 4x4 that was out back of the shed forever. Cut it to sit on the strut towers, but fit between them. The leftover part was notched out to fit over the first support and rest on the radiator support. I positioned everything and drilled two holes to line up with the engine support brackets. I used some long eye bolts to support the engine, and then crank on them to lift it up as I jacked it up. Worked perfectly for what I needed to do and cost me $0. But it can be made with whatever you have laying around. The engine is not that heavy.

[59chevy]

sorry.... also make sure to check your abs wires as they are clipped all along the front of the support , you should be able to do it. aint as hard as i thought it would be.

[SyntheticShield]

Lordy, why aren't you guys closer to me? I figure I can do it, but not having done it before it would be really nice to have someone that has watching over to make sure I dont do anything stupid.

I have a friend that has given me one of the portable air compressors on two wheels, all I have to do is go pick it up. But I dont have any air tools because I have never owned an air compressor. So I may have to do this without air tools unfortunately.

[59chevy]

just run down to sears and get yourself a cheap chicago pnuematics impact gun , their cheap and ok for the price and work great for occasional use. for everyday use get yourself a good ingersol rand 1/2 drive impact.

i wish you lived closer, we would have that bad boy on the floor tonight lol .... i dont know why but have more motivation to work on other peoples cars than my own. take your time , watch for wires clipped to the craddle, its not as bad of a job as you would think looking at it. i was scared goin in also but once it was out on the floor i thought to myself , man that was a cake walk.

you really dont even have to take the struts or spindles all the way out , you could just unbolt the lower ball joints , then sline the axles out of the hubs , but i figured it was only a matter of unbloting the calipers and the three upper mount bolts and there was all that much more room to work.
and when doing something for the first time they are not "stupid mistakes , they are uneducated mishaps".

[Zef_66]

Lordy, why aren't you guys closer to me? I figure I can do it, but not having done it before it would be really nice to have someone that has watching over to make sure I dont do anything stupid.

I have a friend that has given me one of the portable air compressors on two wheels, all I have to do is go pick it up. But I dont have any air tools because I have never owned an air compressor. So I may have to do this without air tools unfortunately.

What do you need air tools for? I have an air compressor, but no tools. And I can do anything at all without a problem. I see no need for air tools at all.

FWIW, when I lived with my dad, we had air tools, and they were usually more of a pain than just grabbing a wrench or socket.

[SyntheticShield]

I probably should invest in some air tools even if they are the cheap ones for now until such time I can get better quality.

You know, Im kinda the same way. I like working on other pretty much more than I do my own. I dont know why that is. I like to work on mine when I have more time than I need to do the work and more money than required to do it right, LOL.

You are probably right about the difficulty. Its just the uncertainty of it all. Ive done nearly all my own work before except when the LIM gaskets were changed out and at that point I was over at Webracin's place and bugged him to tears. That wasnt a bad job, just labor intensive.

What I need to figure out is whether or not having pulled out the output shaft is going to matter and whether or not I can just put the differential back on it and slide it back in and be done with it?

I would probably go ahead and pull the struts out just for the room and such and Im comfortable with that having had to replace the axle shafts. Ive got new ball joints in so I will need to get a tool that can pop those out without damaging the boot. I have a fork to pry them out but I think it would mess up the boot and I have no spare ball joints. Ive seen the tool before I just need to pick it up.

And yeah, I agree with the uneducated mishaps, LOL. My big issue right now aside from needing to do the work is that I would likely have to do it over the course of a weekend and which Im sure it could be done, I would rather have a few more days for anything I miss or have an uneducated mishap with.

[SyntheticShield]

What do you need air tools for? I have an air compressor, but no tools. And I can do anything at all without a problem. I see no need for air tools at all.

FWIW, when I lived with my dad, we had air tools, and they were usually more of a pain than just grabbing a wrench or socket.

Well I dont know that I would need air tools, I was asking more for the sake of benefit and trying to cover all my bases. If I can do it with hand tools I may have to do that since I have yet to pick up the air compressor.

[59chevy]

What do you need air tools for? I have an air compressor, but no tools. And I can do anything at all without a problem. I see no need for air tools at all.

air tools are not a must , they just make the job easier, all i know is when running out the lower strut bolts or zippin the 2 rack bolts off the frame its 2 minutes verses 20 minutes.

as for seperating the lower ball joints , i have that tool and think it blows .. i usually just take the castle nut off and strike the side of the spindle where the ball joint goes thru a couple times with a large hammer and it breaks the taper , same with tie rods. pickle forks are good if your replacing the part.

[SyntheticShield]

Lots and lots of good ideas and suggestions in here. Thanks for them all and keep them coming if there are any more.

[turbocharged406sbc]

if your doing engine work at the same time do yourself a favor and yank the engine out once its out the trans comes out very easy, i'll usually pull the pass axle and shift the trans over to remove the D side axle then bam yank it out

air tools kick ass, hell having the right tools kicks ass
a 36" matco 1/2 to 3/8ths extension is great for the "bastard" bolt, do yourself a favor and remove the oil pressure sending unit when getting the extension through to get the bastard out without breaking it... (though check the OPS plug for oil on the inside...if oils inside the connector, replace the sender as it's leaking internally).

taper studs are easy to remove in most cases unless someone overtightened them from a previous repair, a hammer and a 3ft prybar are all ya need, pry down on the LCA and swing the hammer (i usually lay my fat ass on top of the prybar and start swinging), though i love my airhammer its a bit loud for late night work in my neigborhood.

i have used 2x4's and a 4x4 for suspending the engine plenty of times
if you go the 4x4 route you can do as i did and use chain with two 12" lengths of 3/8ths-1/2" allthread and drill the wood for them, this allows you very finite adjustments to account for the sag of the wood as well as a large range of travel, it's not often but i've had a few scary moments with nylon ratchet straps.

good luck and have fun

[Toasty]

the harder part is puting the cradle back in with one person... best trick i've seen for that is a pallet and pallet jack...but not many people have those handy!

[SyntheticShield]

James, thank you for your insight. I was given a 1/2" socket extension that is 36" long not two weeks ago, so I just need an adapter and I'll be good to go there. I would really like to pull the engine but doing the tranny is a challenge in and of itself for me and I dont have a cherry picker in which to pull the engine out. I wish I did. Heck I wish I had more garage or storage room, there are several tools I would like to have.

Does anyone know where I can get the cradle mount bushings at. If Im going to drop the cradle I want to replace those bushings completely. Heck if I could get my hands on one Id just replace it with an aluminum cradle but time is against me on that one.

[Zef_66]

air tools are not a must , they just make the job easier, all i know is when running out the lower strut bolts or zippin the 2 rack bolts off the frame its 2 minutes verses 20 minutes.

as for seperating the lower ball joints , i have that tool and think it blows .. i usually just take the castle nut off and strike the side of the spindle where the ball joint goes thru a couple times with a large hammer and it breaks the taper , same with tie rods. pickle forks are good if your replacing the part.

As I said, I don't have air tools, and I can get stuff done just as quickly I think. As long as I have all the tools handy and don't have to run, it is not much different. As for the strut bolts, I remove the nut, which once loose comes off with fingers, then a hammer and punch and the bolts fall out. Overall, less than 2 minutes.

For the rack to frame bolts... I think I used a ratchet wrench, which again makes as quick of work as air tools would.

While I agree that they are nice in some instances, I get by just fine without them. And I do tons of work to my cars and truck.