Thread: open air filter in engine bay

You can find this info in any number of books. On a daily driver thought that hot air makes a big difference. Last summer, after reading what Mat T wrote I thought ok, maybe the real engine builders may be wrong so lets test this open cone thing. My main thought was, if this really works I can get rid of a lot of clutter under the hood. On a hot summer day I pulled my Wizaired out and installed an open cone. The car was noticably slower driving aound at 45 MPH. I was watching my IAT's which never got below 120* iirc. I went back home and within about 45 minutes I had the wizaired back on and repeated the same path. Like normal the car was very responsive and IAT's while moving were never more than a couple degrees above ambient.

The other thing people, especially those w/o IC's, notice is that their cars seem much quicker during late fall and winter. I believe even back in the day once my carb'd cars were up to temp (manual chokes back then) they felt quicker during the winter.
Again we are talking daily drivers here. No biggy though. Those that want to read up can do so, and try this out for themselves.

I will have to go with Lee on this one. When I first got my GTX, I removed the SLP's Ram Air box infavor of my old Thrasher CAI. When Reptile came up from KC one Saturday in July we went out for a tune of my car and he was reading my Air temps and the Trasher did not help reduce the air temps from the CIA to the TB. I dont know if this is a poor design on Thrasher's part or what? But I know Alex, who use to have a Thrasher as well experienced the same issue.

I know for myself I switched back to the SLP Ram Air Box and just heat wrapped the bottom portion of the box to help with heat resistance, but I have yet to get any good scans done to see what the differences are, but given the current season I'll have to wait till warms up a bit

I had a goofy idea of gutting the side of the SLP box, which already had slits in it to draw from the fender well, all be it a distance from the actual wall of the fender and air box, but I was thinking of running a bit of a longer PVC piping to extend the filter outside of the Air Box to reach into the fender well to try and draw in more "fresher" or "colder" air than what is inside of the engine bay. But Jason77 said the benefits would be minimal at best. So I scrapped that idea.

So I just decided to move AIT sensor to one of the corners of the air to get a better air reading of air coming in from the Ram Air port and the actual filter instead of what is coming in at the TB connection. (see pic below)

Originally Posted by IndeedSS

Here is something Kenne Bell has on their website about Hot Air Intakes and as far as know they don't sell CAI
http://www.kennebell.net/techinfo/ge...AirWARNING.pdf

very good read and alot of info IndeedSS !

Originally Posted by bayareagtp

very good read and alot of info IndeedSS !

That is pretty much an industry standard view and although the article is aimed at Kenne Bell users the science behind it is solid. It seems to me that most builders go to great lengths to get the coldest air intake as possible. You see this in even new vehicles where there is a performance upgrade available. Sometimes that upgrade package has a different intake and that intake more than not is made to intake more ambient air. My thinking about all of this is there has to be a reason.

Originally Posted by Fish

This argument is beaten more then intense lsd issues. Run what you want. I know what works for my car and it will work fine.

I also know who will be faster at BGPM if we both go.

I plan on letting someone else that races frequently give mine a go. I've never raced a car at the track so, reaction time etc would be a new thing for me.

You have a Gen 5 setup, and a bunch of other things, which would prove nothing anyway since we have different mods. However, I'm willing to let the same individual run mine twice once with an open cone and one with the Wizaired properly installed to see what kind of difference it makes. I've had my Wizaired in and out sooo many times testing this intake debate thing, I can get it swapped pretty quick. It still won't prove anything other than what will get you down the track faster. This kind of testing does not apply to a heat soaked engine bay on a daily driver, but at least it's something.

I already know what works best on the street, but track results would be good too.

hai FTW

yea i guess if you believe something works best for your car you should run it but i would think that cold air would get you more power , but i can also state that when i had my ford 5.0 my ghetto rigged open air filter in the engine i ran faster times than when i had my old cold air intake when i was racing and daily driving it felt alot faster , but i would also think because our vehicles are s/c we should want the coldest air possible to keep the heat down in side our s/c for more power .

good point but wouldnt that extra 5-10* still add up ? i am new to s/c cars so i may ask some stupid stuff but i dont want to mess up the first time i would rather do thing right the first time .

Originally Posted by Fish

Right now Im non ICed. However the core and rad are at the end of my bed. You figure the extra 5-10* hotter air is nulled the second it goes through the core.

Still 5-10* hotter than it could of been. However the Stage 3 like I had reduced temp buy 144* so would you be able to tell? Nope.

I'd say gut the airbox and put a K&N panel filter in. Don't run it with no lid. Not a good idea. imho

the kenne belle cant possibly compared to the m90. i agree, the colder the air, the more dense, and the more power ASSuming airflow is the same. my car gained HUGG numbers on the Hz scale when i ditched the FWI. every car is different, but my car makes more power, with a HAI. sure, i could have cooler air with a FWI, but the more volume of air, makes more power in my case. for a non i/c'd, daily driver, that sees a lot of in town driving (not my car at all lol), a FWI it probably best.

But i'm sure, at the track, for any of these cars with the Heaton blower, a HAI with the headlight removed, will be the best bet. for that quick 12 seconds (or more) the IATs will not be any cooler with the FWI. even they were a couple degrees cooler, the volume would far outway the gains from the colder airflow.

Originally Posted by IndeedSS

Also note that most asking the question about intakes are not modded near enough to worry about having enough air flow.

I think I've figured out what isn't clear. You are not going to get any more air flow by putting a cone on your TB versus another 8" of 4" tubing with the filter in a box. As long as the box, like the wizaired is open to the area behind the headlight and the fenderwell. You get low restricted air flow and 40* cooler air. I mention the 40*, because the day I tested an open cone versus my Wizaired it was ~80* and my IAT were ~120* with the open cone, and no higher than 87*.

First I disagree with the being modded and intake statement. OEM Induction systems are hugely restrictive in most applications. The air requirements for an engine are huge. I used to have the numbers somewhere and I'll see if I can dig them up again. So whether you are modded or not, the engine will ALWAYS benefit from better air flow.

Aftermarket systems that use lots of piping, more specifically piping with lots of bends or large degree bends are going to be a huge hinderence to air flow. ZZP did some testing that showed this. Essentially, anything less than straight into the TB is going to pose a restriction. Every bend in an intake system, no matter how small will have an impact on total air flow. Any change in angle is going to affect air flow.

The question then becomes is it better to have higher IAT's with higher air flow or reduced air flow with lower IAT's. Considering that the air goes straight into the blower that is its own source of heat cannot see that it would really matter in the grand scheme of things.

Furthermore, there is air flow over the headlight. Yes, more so when you remove it, but our headlights are not sealed off from the outside. So if you do have a HAI on, at speed, you are going to get some cooling effect. Now if you stop and idle a lot such as you would with city driving, I can certainly see this being an issue, but if you are in the city where there is frequent stop and go traffic, I doubt you will be getting into boost a great deal.

Im not induction expert, but just thinking from the common sense side of it, I think the choice in intakes depends on a few factors:

1. Your driving habits (as mentioned above, all city, all highway, or combo)
2. Esthetic's (which is cooler, the $250 FWI, or the $40 short ram HAI intake)
3. Installation difficulty and maintenance.

Of course cooler denser air would be more beneficial than warmer air but I know of no application on the market in which tapping into that cooler air doesnt introduce some bends and angles that reduce overall flow.

...

Well please do. If Im off base, let me know. Im just trying to think it through from a common sense stand point.

Originally Posted by archemedes

I honestly think on a street car the differences are negligible as far as power, but I wonder how mileage may be impacted. I think the cooler air will help that more than the restrictions introduced would hurt. Now on a race car that all goes out the window as your looking for 1/10 of a hp in one place to go with 3/10s in another

Hotter air would be more beneficial for mileage. It helps with fuel vaporization. Its odd really. Hotter air costs you power, but you get better mileage. I have even seen set ups that are designed (not intakes specifically) to warm the fuel up some in order to promote vaporization.

I have contemplated ways, for in the winter time, to up the IAT so that you do not take the mileage hit you do in the cold winter air. The problem with such an attempt is that you would need a way in which to turn it on and off for the days that are warmer than normal and/or be easily removed for the spring/summer months.