help needed imediatly!

**riceburner** · 12-14-2008

so i was driving my '01 gtp today and it was running a little rough on start-up but then smoothed out and ran like normal. good power and sputter or anything. then about 20 min into my drive the SES light comes on and all of the sudden a nasty sputter appears and power loss is substantial. about a min after that happens (trying to get to a part store) the engine just dies...will not start back up. no sounds of combustion in the exhaust. i compressed the fuel pressure fitting and there is fuel pressure there.

does anyone know what might be wrong?!? i need this fixed as soon as possible!!! any help would be great and thanks in advance!

**SyntheticShield** · 12-14-2008

Well obviously, knowing what the code is that set the SES light would be helpful. Theres several things that could cause what you describe.

Any recent maintenance done? If not, when was the last work done on the car. Could be the MAF sensor, CPS, etc. Also, just because there is pressure at the Schrader valve doesnt necessarily mean there is enough to keep the car running.

Right now, to really help out it would be helpful to know what the code is that set the SES light. Wish I could be of more help, but there are a lot of unknowns.

**Street Wolf** · 12-14-2008

x2 get the code checked and answer your own question.

**GTX** · 12-14-2008

3rd for ses code, bring it over to my house and I'll scan it for you free!

it sounds like a MAF issue or possible CPS in the description. leaning more towards the CPS though

**riceburner** · 12-14-2008

i dont think i9 will tow it across three states lol... but the code that checker pulled was a "random misfire" codedont remember the exact number sorry...as for past maintinence, i replaced the LIM gasket around 3k ago, and just put a new filter on on friday.

**SyntheticShield** · 12-14-2008

Well Im going to go out on a limb here a bit, though not too much.

First, when it sputtered and died, did your Tach go to zero or did the TCS light come on? If so, thats common symptoms that your CPS is dead. The fact it wont start back up is another. However, in most cases, the CPS just makes it difficult to start back up, sometimes taking several minutes before it will run again.

What I would do now is pull the #1 plug wire and see if you have spark there. I dont know how mechanically inclined you are so if you dont know how to check for spark, speak up and I or someone else will let you know what to do.

If you have no spark there, then it is likely the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) is shot.

**riceburner** · 12-15-2008

i pulled the plugs, and they are just a bit wet with gas, i checked all the wires and the coils with the ohmmeter and then continued to test for spark, which there was... i am going to check if the coils are grounding out and replacing the fuel filter tommorrow. is there and way to check the FP or FPR?

it was around 2* out when this happened too....would the utter cold effect sometghing?

and i am a mechanic in training so i know my way around most things...just learning the electrical stuff though....

**SyntheticShield** · 12-15-2008

Okay, cool. Well to check the FPR, just pull the vacuum line going to it. If there is fuel there, its likely the FPR is bad, should be dry on that side of the FPR.

**riceburner** · 12-15-2008

were are on the fuel rail right? haha sorry.

btw i have noid lights, spark testers and a fuel press guauge at my disposal too

**SyntheticShield** · 12-16-2008

Right, the FPR is on the fuel rail. Front side, towards the left side of the engine.

If you have a fuel pressure gauge, I would start there and make sure you got about 40 - 45psi there at the schrader valve. I dont think you will need a noid lights (though congrats to you for having them, few people keep these around. I have a set and love them) unless we start testing the injectors.

You'll have to check the spark after it dies and is difficult to start back up. The CPS will shut down on you and then after some period of time kinda reset if you will and then you can start the engine again.

**riceburner** · 12-16-2008

fuel pump primes for 2 sec on turn of key and the fuel pressure at the valve reads a constant 42 psi, and i tested the front bank wires with a plug tester, 1,3,5 show consistant spark.

**carl06GT** · 12-16-2008

does it start up and then die if you dont keep in the throttle?

**riceburner** · 12-16-2008

it does not start at all....which doesnt make sence...it looks like its getting air fuel and spark....

**SyntheticShield** · 12-16-2008

Okay, so you got spark, you got fuel.

Does it turn over fine? Does it act like its going to start but just doesnt or does it just crank and crank? Have you tried disconnecting the battery for a short period of time and see if that helps (yes, I know its unusual but at this point Id try anything personally).

Were you able to get the fuel filter replaced? Though I dont think that would cause a no start issue, if it did it would have to be one seriously clogged fuel filter.

**riceburner** · 12-16-2008

i pulled the batt for a bit to charge it. and i have not yet replaced it...i just bought the filter, 103's and new wires...so i guess we will see if that works...and yes, it just cranks and cranks...would the crank or cam position sensor be the culprit? how would i go about testing those?

**SyntheticShield** · 12-16-2008

Well here is another suggestion, spray some starting fluid into the engine and see if it starts, even momentarily, if you have some around.

The CPS controls two functions, the tach signal and the ignition signal, its a two part sensor. Since you have spark, the if the part that controlled the tach signal were bad, you should still be able to start the car.

Now the cam position sensor I have no real experience with and quite frankly Ive never heard of one going bad, but thats not to be taken as they dont go bad. Im not sure how you would go about testing the cam sensor either. Its a magnetic type sensor (forgot the technical term, Im dazed out from cold medicine) so I would imagine that you could test it with a multimeter set to mesure continuity or ohms and then putting it near a metallic surface. You should see it change state on the multimeter.

Keep in mind I dont know that for a fact since Ive never had to test the cam sensor before.

Also, before we get too deep in this and forget the really simple things, have you check all the fuses? Particularly the ones under the hood.

**riceburner** · 12-16-2008

haha no.....guess i should do that huh??? rofl

**riceburner** · 12-17-2008

it was the fuel pressure reg. so i replaced that and it started up, ran rough for a few mine and smoked a lot. then started to smooth out. and about 5 min into run time the car did it again!!! no start condition :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: what the heck?!? could there be anything wrong with the regulation system?....i plan on taking the regulator back for another one tommorow...could there be a short in the vacuum control for the reg.? i noticed it was going to a box....here is a pic of how it was smoking on first start up....

**SyntheticShield** · 12-17-2008

Im not aware of any system that regulates the vacuum. Now its possible that you have a vacuum leak but I would have expected that to show up, at least in part, with your fuel pressure test, that is to say fuel pressure readings would have been off.

So we know it starts, we know it started after your replaced the fuel pressure regulator. The first thing to do would be to start tracing out those vacuum lines and make sure they are all in good shape (no cracks, holes, etc) and are all connected.

You kinda got me thinkin' you have a dual issue. Try and start it up this morning and let it run if it will start up. If it still just cranks and no start, post up here and let us know. I'll try and keep an eye on the thread, but I'll be at work so I cannot promise anything.