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05-04-2012
No spark, like screw driver in the wire close to the block, no spark.
Few things:
Post #9 someone asked about the crank sensor
OP says there is no cam signal
Post #34 Bill asks about the wiring harness
Hmm. I'll bet they left the 97 wire harness that goes to cam sensor, crank sensor and ICM. Bill is that pigtail different from 97 compared to the other years 98-03? It's most likely the same but I figured I'd ask.
Also, should he be looking at the crank sensor as well?
05-04-2012
That part of the wiring is the same. The only real differences in wiring that I'm aware of are at the pcm connector.
05-04-2012
that's what I was thinking about today, I have the original harness from my original motor still, but my stepdad hooked it up with the one that came with the motor...he says its a PITA to switch the harness now that the motor is in, he seems intent on that not being the issue though. I am getting fuel in the rails, we checked that as well, never checked the plugs themselves, but we have it in the rail.
05-04-2012
ok so I'm confused by one thing i saw here, do I need to change out entire wiring for the motor with my wiring from the 2000, or just the pigtail?
05-04-2012
neither until you answer some questions
What year is the pcm?
What year is the main engine harness?
Are your plugs getting wet? (do you hear the injectors upon priming?)
If you take a wire off a coil pack..and crank it, do you see spark jumping?
The ICM/crank wiring...it's all the same 96-08. No worries on that part. Leave that alone.
Answer those questions and I'll feel much better and be able to help more.
05-04-2012
the PCM is still the original PCM so it's a 2000. the main engine harness is a 97(I believe. They just pulled the old motor out and dropped the new one in. the old motor was a 2000 and the new is a 97). Not sure if the plugs are wet, but we are getting pressure in the rail. When you pull a wire off the coil, there is no spark at all when crankingOriginally Posted by BillBoost37
05-04-2012
Dude..you likely said a second ago that you know the problem.
The 97 wiring main engine harness is pinned differently at the pcm then the 2000. So your computer is likely putting the pulses and other stuff to the wrong wire and that's why it's not working.
Gotta go back and read page 1 to see what you were doing.
05-04-2012
Ok, post says you got a new motor.
Old motor is 2000 SC
New motor is 1997 SC, please confirm this to be true.
PCM is a 2000 from the GTP
Therefore the only thing you need to confirm is that the main engine wiring harness is from the 2000 or the 97. If you looked at them quickly, you can not tell the difference. The only way to tell is that the wiring pins are different at the pcm.
05-04-2012
ok, is it easier to get a 97 pcm? we switched the pig tail from the ICM to the cam and crank sensor, and no change either. all of the wiring in the car I believe is from the 2000
05-04-2012
See the quandry here? Within 5 minutes you change your story. It's impossible to diagnose the purple spotted, glow in the dark unicorn that you are presenting to us.all of the wiring in the car I believe is from the 2000
Please make the phone call to your dad etc and find out these answers.
What year is the pcm?
What year is the main engine wiring harness?
Are the plugs getting wet with fuel?
If one of the plug wires is removed at the coil pack and the car is turned over...is there a spark jumping around?
You answer those questions for me, and I should be able to have that car running in under an hour.
05-04-2012
I see what you are saying. The best way that i can put it is that they unhooked the old engine, left all wires intact in the car, pulled it out, dropped in the one from the 97 plugged it all in. the pcm was not changed so it is indeed a 2000. and there is no spark jumping around when we crank the motor. does that make any more sense? I'm sorry not meaning to confuse ya.
05-04-2012
I picked the motor up from a salvage yard, it was a running motor before they took it out, but all I got was the motor wrapped in plastic.
05-04-2012
I have the ability to change usernames. I'm getting very close to changing yours for a giggle.
Why did you say you think the wiring is 97 if you then say other things.
Read the below twice:
I can easily help you. However you are currently standing in the way of me helping you. Answer those four questions and I can help you. This is really not a hard issue to solve. Right now the biggest issue I am having in helping you is getting the information needed to help. Answer the questions, clearly and directly. Thanks
05-04-2012
What year is the pcm?
The PCM is the same one that has always been in the car, it is a 2000
What year is the main engine wiring harness?
I'm still not clear as to what you mean by this( I am trying to get you the answer you need though), is there a harness that is actually in the engine itself? From what I was told all of the wiring that was attached to the original 2000 motor remains in the engine bay and is being used for the 97 motor.
Are the plugs getting wet with fuel?
The engine is getting fuel
If one of the plug wires is removed at the coil pack and the car is turned over...is there a spark jumping around?
There is no spark jumping around when the car is turning over and a plug wire is removed from the coil pack
05-04-2012
Find out about the plugs being wet. This is important because if the pcm isn't commanding the fuel injectors to fire, it is likely it's also not commanding any spark. It brings us in a different directly.
The wiring harness I'm talking about is the one that is connected to the pcm, and then it connects to the fuel injectors, throttle body sensor etc etc. It's the main wiring that lays on the engine. The little guy that goes to the crank and cam is mute
05-04-2012
Thank you for your patience. The wiring harness year is 2000 as well because i did not get a harness with the motor I bought. I will get on finding out about the plugs for you
05-06-2012
ok, so checked the plugs, they are bone dry. what would cause the pcm to not command the injectors?
05-07-2012
Exactly.
You get cranking, no spark and no fuel injectors. Which makes me wonder if you are getting the fuel pump. Check the starter to ensure it has the battery cable plus two wires going to it's main stud.
Then negative battery cable and two ground loops going to the grounding point at the trans stud
The top of the relay center should have a lead from the battery connected to the post. I don't know that you'd get crank without it, but check it anyhow.
The behavior is now beginning to seem like you are missing either power or ground. A test on the fuel injector plugs. Turn the ignition on and test for power. The pcm toggles the ground, so don't expect to find ground present.
I realize you aren't getting cam signal, but I don't buy that as a reason for not starting. W/o cam you have a 1 in 6 chance each time the key is turned of it starting.
05-07-2012
yup i had a similar problem because i forgot to hook up the power wire to my fuel pump rewire. check all the fuses too.
04 Impala SS Indy:
05-07-2012
I am getting fuel at the rail and hear the pump every time I turn the key to the on position. still going to check my grounds and things again. My stepdad insists he checked over all that, but I will see what i can find out.Exactly.
You get cranking, no spark and no fuel injectors. Which makes me wonder if you are getting the fuel pump. Check the starter to ensure it has the battery cable plus two wires going to it's main stud.
Then negative battery cable and two ground loops going to the grounding point at the trans stud
The top of the relay center should have a lead from the battery connected to the post. I don't know that you'd get crank without it, but check it anyhow.
The behavior is now beginning to seem like you are missing either power or ground. A test on the fuel injector plugs. Turn the ignition on and test for power. The pcm toggles the ground, so don't expect to find ground present.
I realize you aren't getting cam signal, but I don't buy that as a reason for not starting. W/o cam you have a 1 in 6 chance each time the key is turned of it starting.
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