Thread: Which Locks and Retainers

Okay, after all the reading and so forth Im still kinda undecided on which springs I need to run with my CC 1.7 Roller Rockers. The choices seem to be:

1. Stock Springs
2. Comp Cams 105 Springs

What I need to know now, is which Locks and Retainers will I need to use?

1. Stock Springs, where can I get new ones at and new locks and retainers?
2. If I use the CC 105 springs, I assume I need to buy the CC Locks and CC retainers, correct?

I have so far:

1. CC push rods, stock length
2. CC 1.7 Roller Rockers
3. New CC 950 Collars
4. New CC Reusable Rocker Bolts
5. New Viton Valve seals
6. Low mileage OEM lifters on the way

So once I figure out which springs, retainers and locks to use, I'll be set as far as valve train upgrades are concerned. But Id like to go ahead and buy the locks and retainers this weekend if I can, but I dont have to. Emphasis is on getting the right stuff.

Okay, you sound pretty certain about that, any particular reason? Or is that experience?

The standard LS1 type retainers for those springs is fine. I didn't think most people replaced the locks.iirc there was problems with aftermarket locks, but it has been at least a year ago when I read about the issues.

Hopefully someone else will give you better info.

from ZZP

Changing the 3800 valve springs to LS1 style spings requires LS1 style retainers to ensure proper spring install height.

CompCams 7˚ steel retainers are precision machined from 4140 chromemoly and finished in black oxide. Comp steel retainers weigh 12.8 grams each.

CompCams 7˚ titanium retainers are American made from 6AL4V alloy and then heat treated. For performance without compromise these retainers deliver! Titanium retainers weigh 7.5 grams.

Modified Valve Spring Retainers have been modified to give an extra .030 clearance to the valve seal. They are required when using the XP cam on stock heads. They are steel and weigh in at 10.8 grams.

From Intense

These Manley Performance retainers are machined to INTENSE's exacting specifications to ensure proper fit and guide clearance. The steel retainers are 22% lighter than Comp Cam Steel retainers weighing only 9.6 grams each. They are made from "Thru-Hardened" 4140 chrome moly material and then given a black oxide finish. The titanium versions are 18% lighter than Comp Cams titanium retainers and 42% lighter than their Manley steel counterparts weighing only 5.6 grams each. The lighter the valvetrain components, the quicker the engine will rev. And shaving a few grams off the end of the valve is enough to add a few hundred RPM before the engine reaches valve float.

Both the Steel and Titanium versions of these Manley retainers offer more clearance than stock and .045" more than a Comp Cams retainer. They are not milled down but rather produced that way to eliminate any fluctuation in production and to ensure a perfect clearance every time.

Engineered to work with stock or other compatible beehive valvesprings with no machining, these retainers are also compatible with factory valvestems and valve locks.

So keep my locks or brand new OEM locks, and upgrade the retainers?

Originally Posted by SyntheticShield

So keep my locks or brand new OEM locks, and upgrade the retainers?

Based on my limited knowledge, I would keep your locks and get the required beehive retainers.

I just realized I will have a brand new set of CC 105# springs and retainers, sitting on my desk Monday afternoon. These I won't be using.

Hmmm you are only installing 1.7 rr? No cam? Age and miles on your car? Depending your answers, I would just use stock springs/retainers. It would be much easier on your tensioner.

Originally Posted by IndeedSS

Based on my limited knowledge, I would keep your locks and get the required beehive retainers.

I just realized I will have a brand new set of CC 105# springs and retainers, sitting on my desk Monday afternoon. These I won't be using.

Hmmm you are only installing 1.7 rr? No cam? Age and miles on your car? Depending your answers, I would just use stock springs/retainers. It would be much easier on your tensioner.

Thats what I was thinking. I mean we are only talking about 0.04 more in ratio. I have no plans for a cam now, I have 117k on the car. My only concern with using stock springs would be that if over time as they age, they may not be enough to stop valve float. But then I weigh that with what is the possibility of valve float with that low ratio upgrade. In trying to give this a great deal of serious thought, I think the most I would do is take out the 1.7's and put in 1.8's, and that would be a ways down the road unless I just found some 1.8's for a steal.

So, why for will you have a new set of CC 105 springs and retainers if you arent going to be using them? You gonna sell them?

Originally Posted by SyntheticShield

Thats what I was thinking. I mean we are only talking about 0.04 more in ratio. I have no plans for a cam now, I have 117k on the car. My only concern with using stock springs would be that if over time as they age, they may not be enough to stop valve float. But then I weigh that with what is the possibility of valve float with that low ratio upgrade. In trying to give this a great deal of serious thought, I think the most I would do is take out the 1.7's and put in 1.8's, and that would be a ways down the road unless I just found some 1.8's for a steal.

So, why for will you have a new set of CC 105 springs and retainers if you arent going to be using them? You gonna sell them?

I think you would be fine up to a 1.84 w/o valve float from what I've read.

I ordered a set of 1.9 modded stockers for my sons GTP during ZZP's woot sale and got, springs, retainers, rocker install kit for $3.

We have no intention of using any of that stuff except for the rockers. So yep I may sell the additional items to help offset what he had to pay for the rockers. The only thing potentially useful to me may be the springs, but I doubt I'll have to replace them on my car.

Well hit me up on PM if you decide to sell them. I dont mind installing the 105's for a little head room. As well if I ever got to 1.8's then those springs would cover that rocker as well.

Originally Posted by SyntheticShield

Well hit me up on PM if you decide to sell them. I dont mind installing the 105's for a little head room. As well if I ever got to 1.8's then those springs would cover that rocker as well.

Probably overkill still for a 1.8 but but I'll shoot you a PM shortly.

So even if I get CC 105 springs I can still reuse my locks, correct? And if I have CC 105 springs, then I need CC retainers, correct?

I just got new valve seals in the mail Friday in fact. So Im good there. Im waiting for my low mileage lifters to get here.

Originally Posted by SyntheticShield

So even if I get CC 105 springs I can still reuse my locks, correct? And if I have CC 105 springs, then I need CC retainers, correct?

I just got new valve seals in the mail Friday in fact. So Im good there. Im waiting for my low mileage lifters to get here.

Yes the LS1 (beehive) CC springs need the LS1 (beehive) CC retainers. And you can reuse the locks. I have CC 105#springs, CC milled retainers, and stock locks installed. My retainers are milled because of the cam.

Well in that case I think Im set. I have everything except the springs and retainers and I know where Im getting those at already so I should be good to go with the valve train upgrades.

Originally Posted by SyntheticShield

Well in that case I think Im set. I have everything except the springs and retainers and I know where Im getting those at already so I should be good to go with the valve train upgrades.

rubs crystal ball and sees a cam in the future.

Originally Posted by IndeedSS

rubs crystal ball and sees a cam in the future.

I just dont know about a cam. Anything is possible I suppose, but right now its the furthest thing from my mind. I have a few other goals in mind that probably arent the norm for the GP community and a cam just didnt factor into the equation really. I'll leave room that it could change, but I dont see it doing so right now. Not unless I get my hands on a low mileage block that I can build up over time.

Ah... better plans in the works trumps aything else.

I said I'd never do another cam after the S1X spun rod bearing thing, and now look what I've done.