I don't think I've ever seen a stock chain break. I've seen quite a few doubles break though.
And, I used to run 130's on a stock chain.
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I don't think I've ever seen a stock chain break. I've seen quite a few doubles break though.
And, I used to run 130's on a stock chain.
The only thing I'm confused about is can you just raise that cylinder to tdc and not even need air. Or are you supposed to raise it to tdc just as a safety netQuote:
Originally Posted by BoostedPontiac
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That's how i did it when i did my cam. No air, no bs, Just put a wrench on the balancer, and put the cylinder you're working on up to the top. The valve will drop a quarter of an inch or less, and you'll be able to just grab it and throw the new spring on.
Also, If you're not shifting higher and are only using 105# springs, I don't know why you're doing a double roller. I did months of research before I did my cam and if you search here and on other sites you'll find instances of the double rollers snapping/breaking. I only found one maybe two times a new single roller broke for someone. But if you already have the double roller, than use what you got and take your chances.
Its not the chain snapping really it's the tensioner getting destroyed fast. I've done a butt load of research and I do agree there is a lot of double rollers breaking but the only ones that break are the ones people didn't modify like there supposed to. I have never heard of any double roller breaking that has been properly modified. People that have had there stock chain break with 105s are very slim I understand but I personally don't want to take that chance. Even if it was a 1 in 100 chance. That's just scary to think your motor could potentially blow up any secondQuote:
Originally Posted by chrsmi1
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I can see your point. Good luck to you either way.Quote:
Originally Posted by suitercrew
Ya Idk I've always taken people's advice on here and so far everything has worked out pretty well so you deffinately have me thinking. I know a guy that has a double roller with the machined pump cover he is willing to sell me for about the same price as a stock chain and dampner, which is why I've been thinking if the cost is equal wouldn't I want the double roller.. Hmm idk
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Double roller has little risk if you have the camphered gear and make sure when you install it you check the slack, ie, chain stretch. And yes, you're correct, the double roller failures were due to circumstances of incorrect installation, they weren't made for the U.S. Engine but have been used with much success when installed correctly. Those promoting the failures, discount the hundreds upon hundreds of installs without fanfare and is old regurgitated information. Anyways...
Fact is this, a double roller is forward thinking. Someone mentioned you may need 130's... but for the time being, you're planning 105's which is fine. If you're getting a deal, same cost as stock single roller, I say go for it, nothing to lose! And should you ever decide to swap valve springs, you're good to go, just take valve covers off, pump some air in there and it's an easy job. Otherwise, if you go 130's later, it's not something I would risk on a single stock chain. Not for long anyways... And if you decide to upgrade then, it's a lot more work and a PITA to take the front cover off while in car. Just saying...
Las for the oil pump, this platform has very low failure rate, but there is spec that can be checked to see if gears have excessive wear and if so, be replaced. I have the manual at my garage and can supply the info if you want it to check. Otherwise, just make sure you pack the gear with Vaseline when closing things up to promote suction when starting up the engine.
The double roller will cause more vibration inside the car since the balance shaft has to be removed.
And a stock chain is not the same thing as a single roller. It has been claimed a few times in this thread that it is, but I should clarify that it is not.
I did more research last night and I found even more oddballs that had their stock chains break on 105s so im just going to go the overkill route and get the double roller and properly modify which I should thank gtppower for providing me with the link to figure that out. Who knows maybe down the road I'll want to add some 1.7s or 1.75 roller rockers or something. Thank you everyone for your input.Quote:
Originally Posted by GTPpower
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Stock rockers make more power.
**** I really need to research this. I've heard it before but still doesn't really make sense to me. Like is it the way the stock rockers are angled that they actually offer more then a 1.6 ratio?Quote:
Originally Posted by GTPpower
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Stock rockers aren't a fixed ratio. They will have a higher ratio with higher lift. With a s1x cam, their ratio is probably around 1.8 to 1.9 at peak lift.
See I really want to believe you but I just don't understand how. Granted I'm definitely no valve train expert. The only thing I can think of would be if the rocker tip was angled or something. If this were true though wouldn't people running an xp cam or maybe even an s1x have clearance issues on stock heads?Quote:
Originally Posted by GTPpower
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a performance cam has larger lobes, aka more lift and duration.
rockers only mimic the stock cam's shape. adding them to a performance cam will end up being to much lift. unless you send your heads out for work and then measure and get custom push rods. in the end its not really worth the extra money spent.
if you have to have roller rockers find a set of 1.6 rockers, thats your stock size.
Take a look at a stock rocker, then rotate it like the cam would. See how with more lift, it essentially changes the contact area on the valve/retainer? It "grows" increasing its ratio.Quote:
Originally Posted by suitercrew
See thats what I was thinking. What does that mean for modded stock rockers then?
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It sucks man I wish I lived in the Midwest there is no one out here that tunes grand prixs. Last time i looked I found a shop that tunes lsx and they said they could do it but wanted frickin 1200$ to put it on a dyno. Like seriously you have lost your dam mind
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Oem chain snapped at 74k miles after swapping in a vs and 105s at ~35k
Saving 200+$ cost over 1000$
On the "nose" our oem rockers get to 1.66 ratio vs the advertised 1.6
See this is why I decided double roller. It might only be a small chance but I'm not going to play roulette with my motor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbocharged400sbc
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