http://www.veryfunnycats.info/wp-con...ute-cats-1.jpg
Printable View
Last I checked, PM stands for Private Message. Nice to know that Mike would just go ahead and send it to you, or anyone else for that matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zooomer
If you notice....it's only words that are being censored. Some of us have kids, and I can respect the fact that responsible parents do not want to see people drop the F bomb, and I'm sure that most everyone here respects that.Quote:
The problem is that once you start sensoring posts of any kind, you risk the issue of becoming what you're complaining about. Then people start getting prefference. ie, well.. I'm not going to ban or sensor him because he's a paying vendor, or has a lot of good posts, or is my friend, etc. This is why it's so important for a good forum to be run by someone who isn't selling parts or doesn't have personal interest in censoring.
Can't say that I speak for anybody else here.....but we're just fine thank you.Quote:
Since I have a good relationship with Mike, I would be more than willing to moderate discussion if someone thinks they have been banned unjustly.
Well to start, the problems we had were with one particular thread that got a little out of control and we are already taking steps to correct that. Otherwise this thing has been running pretty darn smoothly because of the involvement of everyone here including the Admins.
I personally disagree withe the statement that if you start censoring posts you risk what you were complaining about. There isnt a civil forum I am aware of that doesnt have some type of censorship on it, whether it be for bad words, pornography, etc. That doesnt mean that preference is being given to anyone. Now I wont speak for the other Admins, but if you were a vendor here I wouldnt think twice about editing anything you posted that was out of line with the rules.
That said, I welcome any of the vendors here. The rules, however, dont change because of money. What I hope to avoid here is such a level of influence on the part of any vendor that community innovation and involvement is stifled. I just cant see banning, rejecting or restricting anyone that is offering a service or product that isnt even offered by the national vendors. That is what I took issue with.
I think the innovation and ideas we see coming from the community spur competition. I think the community is smart enough to sort out who the jokers are and who is the real deal, who offers great stuff and services and who doesnt.
If you came here as a sponsor, Wbody, Intense, any of them, Im not going to stifle someone like Farnsworth just because you are a paying vendor and dont offer the same stuff he does. If someone like Trannyman comes and can offer the same or better quality at a better price, why should he be booted? Isnt that what competition is all about, choice?
In my opinion, one of the areas that CGP failed is in offering a fair venue for the Garage inventors and vendors to help grow the community. I dont see the interest in community involvement, innovations and open mindness there. It doesnt seem like its about what can be done for the community but what can be done for CGP and I just have a little issue with that. Im not against Mike having a profitable site, good for him for being able to do so. I do have a problem that it has come at the expense of maintaining interest, involvement and enthusiasm from the community as a whole.
Now, I want to stress I would welcome you here if that was what you wanted. I also must state clearly that my opinions are based on what I have seen and experienced from my perspective alone. I dont know what all Mike or you have had to deal with or have seen, heard, etc. So I can only speak from what I know.
What I will fight to the end for is anything that keeps the focus from being on the community or anything that stifles the tallent and skills that are out there that have the new and innovative ideas. And freedom of speech comes with a price. You have to listen to those that disagree with you. I cannot STAND anyone that burns a U.S. flag I think its wrong to the core. But I will defend their right to do so at all cost because that IS their right.
I would also like to offer my apology that things got so out of hand, particularly with the accusations. As an Administrator I take full responsibility for that and not taking action sooner. That is on me and you have me alone to blame. My word to you, however, is that I will do a better job from here forward in keeping things from getting so out of hand and I hope you will forgive me and accept my apology for not having done so in the first place.
I hope that we continue to see you here, I hope you feel comfortable in visiting here and being a part of this community.
wow, Scotty. that was very well written.
I will add to ^^^ by saying that this forum will be evenly ran across the board. No matter if your a paying Vendor, Donating Member, Active User, or a guest. Rules are rules, and they don't change on this forum, based on your income, status or how many friends you have or how much you have contributed. We are still working on getting things in place so that this goal can be achieved.
Every user has a section that cant be seen by anyone but the admins and moderators. When an infraction is found it will be logged so we can keep track of how many infractions each person has. The goal is to make this a fun place for everyone, not a romper room for a few.
[On soapbox]
With that said, the rules are being worked out as we speak, and I have placed some temp rules to go by in each topic, so please read them, follow them and this will be a great forum to help out the community.
I am a very transparent person, and I think that everything should be on the up and up, so while the details are still being worked I can tell you this. No one will be banned from this site and not know why right up front. I believe in the 3 strikes your out rule, now that does not mean a permanent out. You should have a second chance and it will be given, however if we don't enforce the rules then the rules will not be taken seriously.
Your not going to make 100% of the people happy 100% of the time, but you should at least try to make the bigger majority of the people happy, and not just listen to the loudest voice out there.
This forum is here for you all, and even if Mike N wanted to come over here and see what was going on, I would hope that we could be adults and either welcome him or say nothing at all. Please don't tear it down because of your disagreements with people. Just don't say anything if you cant be civil. Debating is fine, and so is constructive criticism, but there is no need to post lies that are intended to be slanderous.
[Off soapbox]
I'm with Brian here. None of my family are young or would visit here, but I respect others that do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptile
x2............Quote:
Originally Posted by UR LOSN
Dave you are a HUGE, and I mean HUGE help to our group. Its seriously "their" loss for giving you the boot. I welcome you here with open arms, and very to happy to have you here!
~F~
I am a clubgp member also.....and thankfully I have not seen the negative things that go on there, but it has been two years since I have returned to the gp world........but from just my short time here, this is a very very nice place and I will make this my choice of gp websites.
I am loving the talk of everyone being equal - on on of my local boards i had to become a paying sponsor to mention that I detail cars on the side. Things should not be that way......so thank you webracin, SyntheticShield, Rocket468 (and whoever else helped this forum start) for trying something new!!!
You can add Chance, perhaps better known as Rocket468 to the list of people involved in getting this show going.
Thank you for your kind words, it is much appreciated. It is our goal to make sure this forum remains a community oriented and focused. I have nothing against any site, Grand Prix site or other that becomes profitable and is able to make its owners money. I say congratulations to them. What I personally have a problem with is letting that profitability come before the community.
I am convinced that if you show people respect you will get it back. If you do all you can for them, they will do the same for you. There are, of course, always exceptions to that, but for the most part that is true. Some of the replies on the other site, particularly from the Mods and owners leaves me with the impression they do not have or have lost their respect for the community. My perception, for what it is worth, is that they have taken the community for granted.
Thats my view anyway, others may not see it that way and Im okay with that. I will stay focused on this site, this community, its members and our vision and goals. I will do everything I can to make sure that every step taken here has the community at its core as a reason. I'll let the rest speak for itself.
added him in there.... :-)
Holy Crap, the SAME kind of talk that is going on here IS EXACTLY the SAME talk going on over at GPNA.com.... Zoomer, I recall you making post on ClubGP in favor of paying Vendor FEES regardless if you are a Company or a "littleman".... Am I right here?
I posted this on ClubGP in hopes it helps some...I am NOT in favor of bringing ClubGP (or any other club) down. But when unfairness hits on a mass scale like it has at ClubGP, the masses are going to react. It might not have been unfairness on Mike N's part, but the inconsistanties with enforcing the rules over there SURE makes it seem like unfairness to quite a few people. I don't think Mike N. expected CLUBGP to grow as much as it has now when he created it in '98. I know that Mike saw alot of what happened to SEGPA. And that probably scared him a bit. Not wanting what had happened to SEGPA to happen to ClubGP, Mike wished to retain MOST of the control . I can understand this. But when you outgrow even your OWN expectations, you need to do more than run things with just yourself and 4 or 5 Mods... Cato even said in his own words, ClubGP was becoming a CHORE. Because the mods were being forced to read EVERY post... Things need to change over there and FAST... Or ClubGP as already seen it's heyday.Quote:
Quote:
Let me give you guys an example. Over at the Cadillac Forums, (CF), they have what would be called an OT Section.... BUT.. There are plenty of level headed mods that DO NOT tolerate any kind of politics or personal attacks ANYWHERE on that site... PLAINLY stated in the rules BEFORE you hit the registration button....
I have learned MORE about the Northstar V8 in 3 months than I've learned about the L67 in 4 years......
The overall mood is friendlier and the newbies are helped. They are MORE than willing to STAY and become supporting members.... .. Plus the place is conducted in a professional manner to the point that several large Cadillac Dealerships have come on board to be major sponsors along with a couple high profile Vendors..
There is no E-Battles between dealerships OR vendors ( Like the ZZP -Intense crap there is here)
The advertising rates are on a STICKY.
The Admin. of the CF is a "car nut". Not just a businessperson who wants to put MONEY in his pocket. Or a CONTROL FREAK.
They offer Supporting Membership which is $5 a month.... You can sign up for as many months as you like. I usually sign up for $20 A TIME. It is the ONLY site to date so far that I have supported with money because of it's professionalism and willingness to help people learn about their cars and diagnose problems without being called whatever names I have seen used on ClubGP...
I can take the verbal crap that spews from some people on here. That's not the point. The point is the professional appearance, integrity & character of an online community is degraded by the actions of a few disrespectful members.
I am in favor of any forum dedicated to car enthusiasts in furtherance of the preservation of their interest. Personally, with my vehicle on her 9th birthday, I consider myself lucky to have access to such forums and the people involved therein. I can't tell you the number of times another Chapter member (all of which I am proud to call friends) has bailed me out of a bind.
What I am against, however, are people who create profiles and such forums with the specific intention of doing harm to someone else. This does not appear to be the case here, so I don't see why anyone would have an issue with yet another resource.
I hope you guys don't hold it against me that I'm active with ClubGp. I have active logins with several other car forums as well.
A BIG X2!!!! I'm also a Moderater at another GP Forum.....Quote:
I hope you guys don't hold it against me that I'm active with ClubGp. I have active logins with several other car forums as well.
I personally have no issue with anyone being active in CGP or any other forum. I personally see this as a good thing, not an act of treason or any other negative connotation. Its a good thing to be involved with a few boards. The knowledge and experience is spread around, the community spirit stays strong.
Our goal was to foster the community spirit. To give people chances and reasons to contribute to the community and make sure they understood they were needed, welcomed and their contributions were valued. Furthermore, we wanted a place the innovation and ideas could foster and not be squashed. A place where information could be centralized and shared and hopefully by doing this and more show our commitment to the community as a whole.
I have said it many times here and I'll say it again. I want this place to be THE place to be. So much so and to such a degree that people without a Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, Regal, etc go out and look for one because they absolutely cannot stand not being a part of what is going on here.
A note to Gearhead43, you cannot compare forum layout of one site or rules and try to deduce a conclution of how a forum should be run. The problem is with the crowd more than the site. Cadillac is a car marketed to an older crowd. Go to any Cobalt or Honda forum and it's out of control. Grand Prix is somewhere in the middle.
I will have to agree with Zooomer on this point.
[QUOTE=Trannyman95;2707]In responce to AlphaBetaBase, Yep I sent out a lot of PMs to members to tell them about this site.QUOTE]
i was one of the member dave pmed telling me about this club. i joined few days later. so far this club rock! it's great to see all the moderators get involve posting. this makes the thread more enjoyable to read.:):):)
So we are somewhere between that old lady that drives 35 in a 55, hunched over the steering wheel and that kid that has a huge nos sticker in his back window? haha jkQuote:
Originally Posted by Zooomer