Thread: need feedback about autoX spring rates for AGX front struts

I have not yet owned any AGX struts, but from what I have leared so far, the highest setting is stock plus 125% more firmness. It's their autocross setting. That would indeed be too stiff for the daily drive.
Input from other AGX owners?

Only rebound is adjustable. Not desirable for what your looking for

Koni yellow sport struts are rebound only.

KYB AGX is double adjustable as one turn of the settings changes both rebound and dampen.. here's the breakdown:

The AGX products have the following approximate
damping force values.
When adjusted, both rebound and compression
damping forces change.
Setting#: Relative Value
1 - Same as Factory 100
2 - Same as our GR2 products (10~15% firmer than
Factory) 115
3 - 50% firmer than #2 172
4 - 30% firmer than #3 223

For an eight position adjustable product, the
damping force values are approx.
the following:
With #2 being Factory at a relative value of 100,
#1 = 95 (5% softer than Factory)
#2 = 100 (Factory damping force)
#3 = 107.5 (7.5% firmer than Factory)
#4 = 115 (15% firmer than Factory)
#5 = 143.5 (43.5% firmer than Factory)
#6 = 172 (72% firmer than Factory)
#7 = 197.5 (97.5 firmer than Factory)
#8 = 223 (123 % firmer than Factory )

The above was a copy/paste fromKYB

the old metal tab adjuster units i have on my shelf have no difference in compression, only rebound.

ill admit i have 4 brand new zzp/agx coilovers from the old suspension design for the 442, but i havent pulled them apart to test for that after we scrapped the mcpherson strut for an SLA with a billet knuckle, clean sheet, everything... and, the kitchen sink.
we couldnt package it, design sucks. we're shooting for 28" slicks under 30" fenders at 3.5" ride height. we woulda had about 1.5" of compression, the good news of that was that the rod /seal overlap reduced the leverage and the seal wiping effect that is the likely reason the the design of the bilstein for the Tq'y ls4 cars. lots of flex in these damn things

i have billet large monoball CC plates for modified towers, including cut to fit chromoly chassis brackets, strut ear/layback plates, 4 custom lower monoball pins for RC correction with inset monoball LBJ plates, custom bump steer/heim joint/monoball pin with steel knuckles, timken bearings with 3.25" studs, retained by stainless shims with built in ears for brake cooling ducts, f body brakes, etc, etc.

we have over 4k in everything and now its sitting on the shelf rusting. ive been implementing what ive learned with the TR.

check the 442's thread and youll see how insane i went to increase the SAI and get the clearance for 14" slicks.

with our new design we'll be able to use f body brakes with the 12" and 11" rotors by just moving the bracket to the proper location. with 11" rotors...we'll fit up to 16" wide slicks on cheap, easy foxbody fitment 15" rims with nice pliant sidewalls. 9* caster 8* KPI/SAI with 1.5" neg scrub so that with some different hoops we can make it handle twisties just as well....with on demand over/understeer from the engines.

**** mcpherson but if your looking fer parts...lol

Check inbox for private message...... budget dictates the retainment of the stock front end for this first build... but what I want is the torsion bar SLA setup from under the 79-85 Eldo with Silverado Z71 torsion bars, 97up S10 4x4 knuckles, 5X115 hubs like I have now, ProComp Es9000 shocks like what I have under the rear, 14" GT500 rotors and C5 Vette calipers.
If not that, then a modified SLA from a 90's Thunderbird or CTS to fit the strut towers that will accept the CV axles. But it'll be a minute before I can afford all that.
For now, the factory tubular LCA with limo poly bushings, AGX struts and some added caster/camber will have to work.... but either way, I get Cad with Vette/Stang brakes.
NOTE: the 79-85 Eldo suspension was such a gooddesign, it was used in the GM 4X4 trucks of the 90's so it all interchanges...well, the front suspension anyway.

http://www.grandprixforums.net/threa...=1#post1382219

sounds like what you really need is to go with a coilover setup and then get happy with a fender roller so you can run a lower offset wheel and still keep it within the fenders.

Originally Posted by 00Daytona

http://www.wbodystore.com/suspension...g-springs.html I do not know the spring rate for these, but I daily my gtp with these and agx struts and they are too stiff for the agx to handle, but it handles super flat and feels like it would be at home on an auto-x track if the control arms and the geometry of the suspension was better.

So I'm basically only replying to this post to put the information out there. I've read most of the first page and not much of the second.

Spring of 2014 as I was piecing my suspension together I was emailing back and forth with w-body store about the springs linked. The back story to the email was I asked them if their springs were re-branded SSC springs because that was a rumor going around and I wanted to know the spring rate because it's not listed. They checked with the people that ship and assured me they're absolutely not SSC springs and informed me that they are 280lbs front and 230lbs back. And they are linear.

I have them on KYG GR-2 struts and don't mind them but they're completely different that AGX so that doesn't mean much.

Oh it does matter because on an AGX with 8 settings, 4 is the same rate as the GR-2 which is 15% firmer than stock. (Or setting 2 on a strut/shock with 4 settings.) Thank you. How much bounce do you get going over rough spots at highway speed?

Sounds like we need eleventybillion pics of this caddy suspension setup! Do show!

im trying to picture the suspension. what year is this caddy? this is the iron knuckle with the tapped hole for camber at the strut mounting bolt as well as the knuckle mounted abs sensor with the tone ring on the cv....iirc its damn near identical to the 90 toronado trofeo stuff sans the radius arm/LCA portion.

Originally Posted by CadVetteStang

Oh it does matter because on an AGX with 8 settings, 4 is the same rate as the GR-2 which is 15% firmer than stock. (Or setting 2 on a strut/shock with 4 settings.) Thank you. How much bounce do you get going over rough spots at highway speed?

I was thinking the AGX had only 4 settings. I don't do a ton of highway driving but over bumps on a country road isn't bad typically. There is more bounce but it recovers quick. The ride is no where near as smooth as the stock suspension was (you can see everything else I've done in my sig) but it's nothing that I can't tolerate.

Originally Posted by Turbocharged400sbc

im trying to picture the suspension. what year is this caddy? this is the iron knuckle with the tapped hole for camber at the strut mounting bolt as well as the knuckle mounted abs sensor with the tone ring on the cv....iirc its damn near identical to the 90 toronado trofeo stuff sans the radius arm/LCA portion.

86-92 Toronado, Eldorado, and Riviera are E-body cars with a 108" wheelbase. The Seville is a slightly heavily K-body that also shares the same wheelbase and suspension. The front suspension is very close to (almost identical) to the W- body except in the latter part of this forth generation when the improved strut mounted swaybars were introduced. Toronado's Trofeo had the FE3 handling package. In 92 all Toronado's got the FE3 goodies.
In 92, the Toronado was discontinued and the Eldorado's tenth generation larger body style began but the entire suspension - including 108" wheelbase carried over. That's why the fenders look like caves on the Eldos and why they have room for 10" wide wheels and lowering. In 92, the Seville grew to a 111" wheelbase and added 200 more pounds, but retained the same suspension .... Therefore, if you find an FE3 Seville, you might find some beefy parts for performance. 97 is a cool year for them because it's the last year they shared suspensions with the Eldo and they received the 97 brakes, knuckles, and tubular LCA upgrade.
In 93, the Eldo & Seville rear suspension went from a fiberglass monoleaf IRS to a double wishbone SLA that looks like a cross between C5 Vette and SVT Cobra(minus the axles of course).
Keep in mind that in a nose -heavy FWD, the rear suspension is the most important for cornering because if it can act like the base of a triangle to stabilize the car, then the front wheels have more freedom to do the turning and accelerating.
93 - 02 Eldos are secret Mustang killers on curvy roads and in drag racing even in stock trim... They have been compared to 80's Ferraris... They were designed for great cornering while riding soft. Stiffening the suspension the right way turns them into very trackworthy competitors. But the idea never caught on among performance enthusiasts, so some individuals like me are given too much credit for driving skill when I blow passed WRX's and 300Z's on the flat 4 lane curves in an area known as "the playground".
My car is a 2002 Eldorado ESC. I chose the non electronic suspension so I could tune it easier.
It is the last year of the Eldorado and has all of the upgrades including Aluminum upper rear A-Arms.
Many components of the Deville also interchange giving me some of the Limo and armored car FE7 suspension swap possibilities, like poly bushings that would otherwise not be available.

Handling wise, I am at a point where I must install seats with side wings because my flatter bucket seats won't hold me even with tight belts so I can't drive with two feet when I need to ; I have to use my left foot as a brace to wedge myself back into it so I don't slide around. That's distracting.

Where are the pics of this beast? My 1st car was a white on blue leather 1992 Eldorado. Such a tank in the snow with blizzaks god I miss that car.

Originally Posted by ImNowTylerTibbets

Where are the pics of this beast? My 1st car was a white on blue leather 1992 Eldorado. Such a tank in the snow with blizzaks god I miss that car.

Right now I have limited internet access because I am working two jobs 6 and 7 days per week for 79-81 hours. My phone usually doesn't cooperate when it comes to posting links to hosted pictures or to uploading them to photobucket.
And this is a GP forum.
However, since a modular K-body or E-body rear end swap would really wake up a W-body car, I will consider a suspension build thread on this forum from the idea of using these cars as donors.
But I need to get further along into my build.
I'll try to get a couple of pics soon .
Thanks

We all love oddball **** even if it's a Grand Prix forum we love seeing other vehicles


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Originally Posted by REDCRAPGP

We all love oddball **** even if it's a Grand Prix forum we love seeing other vehicles


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Okay. Well if you have an " other vehicles" section, Ill focus on the car there. But i'll eventually do just a suspension build in this section, but in another thread. Thanks.

Okay, just a few pics.... don't want to get too far off topic. The wheels are 2006 or 2008 Mustang GT. 18 X 8.5" wide and tires are 255/45 ZR18




I could fit 11" wide wheels in the back with 315/35's




Room in the front for 10's with 275/40's..... maybe 285's...

Sooooooo basically let me get this straight us poor wbody bastards with the 4t65fail transmissions need to be robbing not only the 4t80s from the Eldos and Sevilles but now the rear suspension too?

Hmmmmm so um who has a wrecked one forsale LOL?

Odd sh1t is cool to see!

Keep in mind that the stock springs and shocks are junk and must be replaced if you want the upgrade to be a night and day difference. The rear end is designed to handle well even in soft trim so it's design is maxed out for having both a high roll center and low center of gravity and to make lots of negative camber very quickly. All of that to enable good handling and soft ride.... the tech i spoke to at KYB said it well when he stated that made "hot ice" when they designed it because typically you get either goodride OR good handling but not both.
BTW, I made a mistake, I have variable rate springs on mine, not constant as previously stated. ... Insidediameter is same as 79-04 Mustang front springs, so Stang lowering springs can be installed, checked for ride height and then cut to make the desired final ride height. ProComp ES9000 shocks can handle high spring rates and auto adjust to ten settings and are less than$50 each.