Makes sense in this case, thanks man. Might have to pull the covers and check.
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Makes sense in this case, thanks man. Might have to pull the covers and check.
Everything in the overflow tank came out on a telescopic magnet so it was just rust and not oil balls.The rad filler neck had some buildup but it was brown and while "oily" I think it was just Dex sludge as suggested and not oil, so I'm better off than I had thought.
Lots of black oil between the plenum and lower intake, but no signs of coolant here...I guess because I have the aluminum plenum that's not affected by the EGR issue. Where is the oil coming from? I found this image...I assume the red lines are oil flow...but that's the MAP sensor hole there on the left isn't it?
Last edited by Jackal; 12-03-2014 at 12:15 PM.
It's from the PCV system. Oil mist just build up and pools in the low spots that can't ge hit by the rushing air past it, which normally just gets burned with the air/fuel and out the exhaust.
It's not an issue, just the way the design is.
Oh yea the PCV is under the MAP right? That's what I had replaced several years ago in hopes that it would slow oil consumption. It did not. Still not sure how this mist would accumulate in this void between the upper and lower, but if I had the parts in front of me to examine I'd probably figure it out. I was rushed yesterday so I didn't take the time to do this. Hope to pull the lower out tonight and start cleaning things up and swapping gaskets and o-rings. I bought full upper and lower Felpro kits. The lower Felpro gasket only was the "second design" gasket but still made from composite material. I had to get the full kit to get the steel or aluminum gasket base.
Is there a trick to getting the coolant elbow back into the lower w/o damaging the new gaskets if taking the shortcut of not removing the PS pump? Doesn't seem like there would be a lot of wiggle room there to make this happen safely. BTW, I had to redo the elbow job after reading all over the net how the HELP! kit from O'Reilly Auto Parts was the exact same parts as the AC Delco crap from the stealership at a fraction of the cost. They lasted a few months tops IIRC and somehow warped out of shape...not a perfect "L" shape when I removed them though I was extremely cautious installing them. They just had flex to them where as the OEMs are a lot more firm. Luckily I still have a second set of OEMs sitting on my shelf so I can use the one for this job.
Yea its plenty tight but seems doable with a second pair of hands. The two pass. side coolant ports that are blocked off at the lower manifold failed at the top side of the gasket. Looks like the plastic structure failed and allowed the gasket to dip down into the port. I believe I dug the composite pieces out last time I did the elbows and flushed the system out.
Did you mean if you don't remove the alternator bracket? Because that is the easy way. If you don't pull it.. yes you can angle the lim while getting the elbow into it.
I did. Yea I just had applied a small amount of RTV to the o-rings as an extra precaution and had to fight it to remove the lower. I won't bother with it on the new one though. Going to start cleanup and R&R all the o-rings and gaskets so I can reassemble tomorrow night and get the oil changed Sat. I didn't get a single drop of coolant in the valley when pulling so not terribly concerned.
I'm not a fan of doing RTV on the o-rings because then it's tougher to clean if you ever go back in. I use a little lube like vasoline or oil to help seat them.
I thought it was funny that up until the lower it was just 9mm and 10mm nuts/bolts and the lower was all 3/8".
THAT's what I wanted to ask last night and forgot all about it, thanks man! Just on the corners then? There are a few odd ball places like this on the Ford modular front / engine / timing covers as well.
Yeah, just lay a small bead in each corner and place the gasket down that goes across. You can RTV the top of the gasket if you wish. Then lay the intake gaskets down and plop the intake on and bolt it down.
i put a dab in all 4 corners, then put the gaskets in, then did 4 more dabs in the corners. this seals top and bottom, rubber to block, and to the metal gaskets and lim.
I let the dealer do mine 9 years ago cost $600.00 thats was before I joined this forum, now that I see the job I am pissed I did not do it myself, they convineced me this was not like the old engines from the 60-70's I was used too and was a huge complicated job since it was plastic. The rats
only real difference is its got a fuel rail and injectors and a bunch of sensors to remove. once the wire harness and injectors are off its just like the old days.
All done, thanks for all the help guys! I would have ended up with composite gaskets most likely. Was disappointed that the kits didn't include the PCV o-rings. I also discovered that I had been running w/o a t-stat housing gasket for years! No wonder you guys didn't understand wtf I was talking about not being able to run it w/o the t-stat in place. Derp.
There are two gaskets that work on the 3800's. A black rubber seal that goes around the thermostat (necessary) and a wide older style gasket that goes in between the thermostat housing and the LIM. I never use those so I can't really say why you should.
Also pcv o-rings don't come with the LIM stuff since it doesn't have to come off. It should come with the UIM gasket, but still not part of the job. I know it comes with the new dorman intake plenum which I'd always recommend doing instead of just replacing the gasket. The stock plenums can crack between the EGR and coolant passages.
I went ahead and used both gaskets, didn't seem like it should be w/o it so I can't imagine it causing any problems...??? I knew of the UIM issue when I got the car thanks to a co-worker who had the same issue, so I made sure to get the aluminum UIM or at least have replaced it right off the bat. I think the long rectangle shaped gasket in the LIM next to the EGR pipe and behind the exhaust pipe was leaking. It looked like hell and there was sludge right there on top of the transaxle.
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