Thread: Fram oil filters - crap or not??

Oil Filters Revealed - MiniMopar Resources

Originally Posted by cerick08GP

That’s because they are the same filter. I just have to say that in the past when GM actually made the AC Delco filters they were good. Now they are farmed out and IIRC they use the exact same Encore design as FRAM now. Hence AC Delco’s are just as bad as FRAM today. Someone correct me if I’m mistaken. Seriously.

I have had FRAMs that the anti-drain back totally failed; I don’t trust their quality anymore. My personal favorite filter, for my money, is the PureONE.

When you say the anti-drain back valve failed, can you explain how you came to that conclusion? I would really like to know. AC Delco and Fram?
They are not the same filter. Champion labs makes the AC delco filter. You really do not know what your talking about if you think the E core filter is no good. Do you really think GM would take on the warranty risk of millions of engines because of a substandard filter? Be serious dude. You or anyone else on the internet cannot tell anything about filter efficiency or capacity by cutting a filter open plain and simple. We get letters every day from loyal Fram users with extremely high miles on vehicles that still run fine.

Originally Posted by SnowDrift

Oil Filters Revealed - MiniMopar Resources

This study does not use any SAE or ISO testing, it is merely one guys opinion after cutting open filters. He is a fan of Chrysler K cars hmm... And it is 15 yr oold information as well.

Originally Posted by Scimmia

I'll qualify this by saying I've never seen it myself, but there are numerous stories around of people bursting the canister on the oil filter.

Dude,
It takes 300psi of oil pressure to burst a cannister on a extra gaurd filter. When that happens, it is because the oil pressure relief valve is stuck, usually from sludge. It is not the fault of the filter, it is an internal issue with the engine. If you ever see a bulging filter, its time to drop the pan and front cover and fix it fast.

Originally Posted by superdve

Wow dude! Since you live in Ohio Motorking and I need to get you to the Fram Engineering lab in Perrysburg, OH before you spend the REST of your life believing what you've read on the internet and by an old Napa/Wix cutaway that is going away because Napa is starting to test and carry Fram in many of its stores.

BEFORE coming to Fram/Autolite/Prestone I used all of the products for over 25 years! In college I sold Fram at the parts store I worked at and used our products exclusively. When I started to drag race all of the racers used Fram and my engine machinist encouraged me to do the same. So that's what I race with then and now. My street cars all use Fram. My main reason is the vastly superior filter media that's inside, not the paint, not the hype, not the internet praise. You may argue that I get the stuff for free so that's why I use it. Nope. I know the engineering and science behind the product.

Most people close their eyes and get their oil changed at a quick lube that buys mostly bulk filters from some pixelated ad in the back of Oil and Lube News and the shop owner PAYS 89-99 CENTS for the popular part numbers like the PF47/3387A. Realize that most all other filters on the market are only 50-60% efficient and that means they let dirt particles in the 10-20 micron range pass un-filtered through your engine and that sized dirt WILL get between your bearings and crankshaft and score your bearings. If you have a HD Diesel, 20-30 microns is the size you need to filter.

Please let us school you here so you can understand the engineering and science behind oil filtration. We think you will be surprised and probably shocked!

We are here to help and I feel I myself have a good history and track record in the 3800 market!

I do appreciate your response and the way you handled it. I'll listen.

I hear what you're saying about micron size and filtration. I've contacted WIX about this before, but didn't have the information in front of me, so I got on their site. Their information says they filter "essentially all the contaminant particles larger than 25 microns" and "Our filters also capture a high percentage of even smaller particles", while the FRAM site says "for particles > 20 microns."

I think we're all splitting hairs at this point if the number is meeting or exceeding the engine manufacturer requirements. Nothing I've seen or heard, so far, is going to sway me to buy an orange filter, but I wanted to communicate to you that I'm not completely shut down to hearing your point of view and I appreciate you sharing.

my work uses filters that are notably worse than fram filters. They've been recalled on two separate occasions for quality control issues.

Used to be made by fram (okay then) now they're made in China and thats when the recalls started.

Originally Posted by matt5112

made in China.

Oh my, that's a whole 'nother conversation, there, my friend.

So dont buy black label canadian tire oil filters.... Only red label ones.

I used to have an F-150 that absolutely hated Canadian Tire oil filters.
I would floor it and it would lose all of its power.
Was finally told to ditch their weak ass filters and it fixed the problem.
Apparently the pressure would suck the element and it would practically crush inside the can.
Funnily enough I moved on to Fram and was fine!

were they black label filters?

Or were they red label?

This was about 10 years ago. The can was white but for some reason I remember the letters being dark blue!
Must have been black letters. Definitely motomaster.
They have probably changed makers since then.

SnowDrift,
seems like you could potentially get yourself a Fram factory tour courtesy of the pros. Might be interesting.

Could be. Perrysburg isn't far from me at all. In fact, it's the same town my wife competed in the Mrs. Ohio pageant several years back.

I guess no definitive answer came of this? I recently was at WalMart getting a filter for my post-LIM operation oil change. They stock AC Delco, SuperTech (WalMart brand) Fram, and I think Mopar and Ford brand versions of the filter. I compared the Fram, the SuperTech, and the Delco. The SuperTech and Delco look like the same filter (obviously different paint on the outside, but they both have the plastic/nylon cage on the inside). The Fram guts were all metal, and the filter media looked a little better as well (although that was just my impression based on what I could see through the peep-hole). The can actually felt stronger on the Fram as well, but that is subjective opinion as well based solely on my highly-calibrated finger squeeze test. I use strictly SuperTech on my other car and have had superb luck with it (as mentioned elsewhere it is the best filter for the money--meaning there are better filters but it is more than adequate at a price that can't be beat), but I pulled one of those to compare, and the guts of that filter was metal also. I think we can all agree that metal is stronger and should withstand oil and contaminants better than plastic/nylon. Even though I use only SuperTech in my other car (again the filter for that car has metal guts), I went with the Fram in this case. I think I even paid about $0.65 or $0.75 more for the Fram as well. This is obviously not conclusive, but based on my observation of the filters side by side, I felt the Fram was better quality. I got the middle of the road Fram, I think it was the extended guard. As mentioned previously, I also feel the bedliner type coating makes it easier to work with. Anyway, I would be interested in any more actual data/facts that anyone has, but I agree that other than factual data everything is opinion and proves nothing. I will mention that the Fram claims 3 times the filtering capacity of standard filters on the box. The SuperTech I think claimed 2X the filtering capability. I don't know that this means anything because I don't know what standard they were using or if they were both using the same standard. Either way, I have previously worked as in a lube bay where we had a cutaway of a Delco, Wix, and some other brand X (could have been a Fram, but I don't remember it being orange), and the Delco in that case looked superior. As mentioned here the Delco filters are not the same and are now much lower quality than the Delco's past. I remember WalMart pulling Delco from the shelves (in my area at least), several years ago. I am guessing that is when they changed. It is now just a name on the box that someone is probably overpaying to use, as the filter itself is no better/different than any other standard (low end) filter.

I have also been wondering about the drain back valve. Isn't the point of that to keep the oil from draining back into the engine after shut off? My car is supercharged and I cannot speak for the other models, but my filter sits upside down, so all the oil stays right in the filter when the car is off. Seems (at least in this case) that the valve is a lesser point in this application. I went with the Fram and I am comfortable with the protection that it will provide. I also beleive that there are better filters out there, but are they worth the extra cost? This almost seems like an oil thread--everyone has an opinion and you are probably safe doing whatever works for you.