Thread: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85.

Page 8 of 12 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast
Results 141 to 160 of 225
  1. #141 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    Quote Originally Posted by Fivefingerdeathpunch View Post
    More fuel isn't going to help you, going richer is the opposite of what I would want to do with E85.

    E85 is great at taking away heat, you should be able to lean the mixture out a little bit using E85.
    I was just about to go and ask my question again, but you answered it. should I change anything other than the maf if I'm only going to run the 40%-50% ethanol blend?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2. #142 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member 91parkave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    2,930
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    258
    honestly don't know why you change your maf curve for e85 or any blend. your stoic is what's ****ed up and needs changing. but since 3800 members don't like stoic adjustments. ifr would be your quickest solution
    06 GXP | 222/227 cam/cartuning turbo kit on 8psi/meth/e85 coilovers/ still on stock trans at 130k
    Reply With Quote  
     

  3. #143 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    has anyone tried emailing HP Tuners to get them to finish mapping the afr table so the "stoic method" can be used effectively?

    and if I did just change the stoic, would I just change that one table? and if so, what would I put in?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #144 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    Awesome Level Member chrsmi1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    824
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    651
    I emailed them to see about unlocking some other tables for it (fuel stuff). It's been two weeks and all I've got is a generic reply. So yeah.
    Comp G. E85, 2.8, Headers, Tune, Intake, S1X, 105# springs, 60 # injectors, 255 walbro,etc.

    *NEW* 2002 Camaro Z28- Lid, Headers, Catback

    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #145 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member GTPpower's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Schuyler, NE
    Posts
    2,973
    Thanks (Received)
    8
    Likes (Received)
    23
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    265
    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMarshal View Post
    has anyone tried emailing HP Tuners to get them to finish mapping the afr table so the "stoic method" can be used effectively?

    and if I did just change the stoic, would I just change that one table? and if so, what would I put in?
    It won't work. You can literally put anything you want into that table, and the car will always correct it to 14.7 once the trims take over. Due to our o2 sensor, there is nothing you can do about it unless you run in open loop.


    2001 GTP Drag Car - XPZ, Tischler heads, Upsidedown M90 IC'd, e85, Gen V, 2.3 w/ 5%OD
    2005 F350 6.0 - studded, deleted, tuned
    2001 GTP - cam, headers, nitrous, stock trans - 11.83 @ 116 <$2k in mods - sold
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #146 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    I read on this site that stochiometric for E70 is 10.69, so if I was running E70 that should be my target afr, correct?

    I am adding a methanol kit, and AEM says to lean the mixture by 1 point, so in this case my target afr would be 11.7, correct?

    any suggestions on where I should set the start psi for the methanol to start flowing and where I should set the full psi?

    http://www.ecmtuning.com/wiki/e85fuel

    http://aemelectronics.com/files/inst...ns/30-3300.pdf
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #147 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    Turbo is the way to go. Fivefingerdeathpunch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Rogers, MN
    Posts
    21,030
    Thanks (Received)
    21
    Likes (Received)
    45
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    83662
    Read post above yours, it does not matter what you change stoich too, it will always correct it to 14.7.

    If you tune in lambda you need not worry about stoich, because stoich is stoich is stoich no matter the fuel you run. If you stay on the AFR scale just aim for similar numbers as you do now.

    SMGPFC Member #1
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #148 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    When in pe mode, isn't it in open loop? And wouldn't it target the afr that's commanded for pe?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #149 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member GTPpower's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Schuyler, NE
    Posts
    2,973
    Thanks (Received)
    8
    Likes (Received)
    23
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    265
    Not really....commanded is usually nowhere near actual, unless you spend the time tuning to get it there.

    Keep your wideband calibrated for gas, and nothing changes. Shoot for 11.5 at wot. Then lean it out til you see knock. Or pulley down.


    2001 GTP Drag Car - XPZ, Tischler heads, Upsidedown M90 IC'd, e85, Gen V, 2.3 w/ 5%OD
    2005 F350 6.0 - studded, deleted, tuned
    2001 GTP - cam, headers, nitrous, stock trans - 11.83 @ 116 <$2k in mods - sold
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #150 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    has anyone actually dyno tested different air fuel ratios of E85 to see what the different power levels are for the different ratios? I've been reading online and have found that E85 max power rich afr is like 6.429 and E85 max power lean is 7.8 while E85 stoich is 9.0078, so are we running our car's lean?

    it would take a lot of fuel to hit those ratios, and the car would probably run really rich all the time.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #151 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    Turbo is the way to go. Fivefingerdeathpunch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Rogers, MN
    Posts
    21,030
    Thanks (Received)
    21
    Likes (Received)
    45
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    83662
    Why would it take anymore fuel?

    I don't think you understand what is going on here. Just because the stoich ratio changes for the given fuel, doesn't mean it going to take a far richer commanded fuel number to achive your goals.

    This is why tuning in lambda makes all this nonsense simple when using E85. Stoich is stoich no matter the fuel you are running. You'd be tuning it for somewhere between .75 and .85 lambda.

    Because you are still using the gas scale on the wideband you have to think about it that way still. 6.429 commanded on E85 is like commanding 10.3 to 10.4 or so on the gas scale. That is still pretty rich. Going to the max lean on the E85 at 7.8 is like running upper 12's on the gas scale.

    SMGPFC Member #1
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #152 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member GTPpower's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Schuyler, NE
    Posts
    2,973
    Thanks (Received)
    8
    Likes (Received)
    23
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    265
    ^^That.

    Quit looking at posts where they are calibrating the sensor for e85. There are no benefits, and it will do nothing but confuse you.


    2001 GTP Drag Car - XPZ, Tischler heads, Upsidedown M90 IC'd, e85, Gen V, 2.3 w/ 5%OD
    2005 F350 6.0 - studded, deleted, tuned
    2001 GTP - cam, headers, nitrous, stock trans - 11.83 @ 116 <$2k in mods - sold
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #153 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    this is what i've learned so far, correct me if I'm wrong: the wideband shows the same afr regardless of fuel used, so since the fuel used has been ethanol based the air fuel ratio will read richer than actual gasoline. The stochiometric ratio for E70 is 10.7, so that is what the air fuel ratio should be.

    I do plan on giving it all a rest because it really is confusing, but if what I posted above is true, then I think i have a handle on it.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #154 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    Turbo is the way to go. Fivefingerdeathpunch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Rogers, MN
    Posts
    21,030
    Thanks (Received)
    21
    Likes (Received)
    45
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    83662
    If the wideband is setup to use the gas scale and you run E85, it's still going to show the stoich is around 14.7 and not 10.7.

    SMGPFC Member #1
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #155 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    what would you guys put for the cylinder gain if the ethanol was 90% content? I was thinking 1.31
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #156 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member GTPpower's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Schuyler, NE
    Posts
    2,973
    Thanks (Received)
    8
    Likes (Received)
    23
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    265
    I've always done 30% increase and let trims do the rest.


    2001 GTP Drag Car - XPZ, Tischler heads, Upsidedown M90 IC'd, e85, Gen V, 2.3 w/ 5%OD
    2005 F350 6.0 - studded, deleted, tuned
    2001 GTP - cam, headers, nitrous, stock trans - 11.83 @ 116 <$2k in mods - sold
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #157 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    http://www.grandprixforums.net/threa...t=97autoxvette

    using this method and targeting 9.8 in open loop, how close will that afr be to actual, and is it like the cylinder gain method where gas mileage is about 30% worse?

    or is it a vehicle specific thing and everyone's car is different?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #158 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GXP Level Member GTPpower's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Schuyler, NE
    Posts
    2,973
    Thanks (Received)
    8
    Likes (Received)
    23
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    265
    It'll depend on the car, but should be somewhat close.

    But you are going out of your way to make this harder than it needs to be.


    2001 GTP Drag Car - XPZ, Tischler heads, Upsidedown M90 IC'd, e85, Gen V, 2.3 w/ 5%OD
    2005 F350 6.0 - studded, deleted, tuned
    2001 GTP - cam, headers, nitrous, stock trans - 11.83 @ 116 <$2k in mods - sold
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #159 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    Regal GS Level Member BoostedPontiac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South Haven, MI
    Posts
    1,140
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    2
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    159
    Why not just change the ifr table and then ve and maf tune?
    98' GP coupe NIC Pacesetters, E85, FSIC, 2.6, heads, blah
    11.82 @ 118.4 with a 1.8 60ft
    Retired: 99' Regal GS Turbo 11.428 @ 122.61 1.7 60ft.
    Retired: 99 GTP top swap nic setup. 13.37@106
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #160 Re: The defacto guide to tuning your car for e85. 
    GrandPrix Junkie SgtMarshal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kemmerer, Wyoming
    Posts
    4,690
    Thanks (Received)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    25
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    60223
    that's too much work. ifr table should be a set and forget deal. it's much easier to change the cylinder gain. I just want to try something different.
    Reply With Quote  
     

Page 8 of 12 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. HKS: Beginners guide to tuning
    By matt5112 in forum General Tech Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-22-2012, 10:09 AM
  2. Gary's tuning guide?
    By Sandman in forum PCM Tuning
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 03-23-2011, 06:53 PM
  3. gtp buying guide
    By windycitygtp in forum General Tech Discussion
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 01-18-2009, 09:09 PM
  4. The Compleate Fuel Economy Tuning Guide
    By TDCRacing in forum PCM Tuning
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 07-09-2008, 11:43 AM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •