Thread: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know

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  1. #41 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sabrewings View Post
    Not sure what tuner you're using, but the DHP PT does it differently. I can set the codes to enable or disabled, and if enabled I can set what type (MIL or no MIL) and how many trips to set the code and how many trips to make it go away.
    HP Tuners calls these check boxes "SES Enable". TunerCat OBD-2 Tuner refers to them as "DTC Enable" (which sounds like the same thing DHP refers to them as).

    The problem is I don't think anybody has the definition for these check boxes entirely correct. In factory stock cal's I have seen these boxes NOT checked for trouble codes that do turn the check engine light on. I do know in the 05 Monte SS cal I tuned, even when setting the DTC to "No MIL"; leaving this box checked resulted in the Driver Message Center lighting up with a warning message stating the vehicle needed to be serviced as soon as the code set (after the cat diagnostic had run). I had to uncheck these boxes next to these CAT and post-CAT O2 sensors codes to prevent the Driver Message Center from displaying these warnings.
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  2. #42 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    GrandPrix Junkie Sabrewings's Avatar
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    Well, it sets the code on my car without a MIL or message, so it's doing well so far. I set it to "no reporting", but the rear O2 codes are enabled in the other table (there are two DTC tables in the PT).
    2004 Impala LS - got some mods sold!!!
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    NAIOA moderator Still Imp'n, just in a different Imp.
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  3. #43 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    GT Level Member tylerbinski's Avatar
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    So I should be alright with 98 PCM and no rear 02 sensor?

    I'm getting the exhaust done tomorrow morning, and wondering whether to have a rear 02 bung and sensor installed or not...

    advantages/disadvantages?
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  4. #44 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tylerbinski View Post
    So I should be alright with 98 PCM and no rear 02 sensor?

    I'm getting the exhaust done tomorrow morning, and wondering whether to have a rear 02 bung and sensor installed or not...

    advantages/disadvantages?
    98 PCM running 98 programming you should have no problems with a missing rear O2 sensor. BUT, you might want to install a rear O2 bung for a wideband down the road just in case.
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  5. #45 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    youtu.be/xhrBDcQq2DM FoSHO99's Avatar
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    There are people who say tiny tuner has the ability to get rid of this diagnostic check.
    2001 GTP PT61 Turbo, E85, Stock Motor
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  6. #46 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    Donating Users nascartech's Avatar
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    old thread but i have a 01 gp and ever since i put in my catted dp i have gotten a code will a o2 sim work
    01 GTP is3 cam 130 springs double roller 60lb injectors lq4 maf headers 4000 stall lowered
    sold 97 GTP stock
    Sold 2001 gp gt ssm90 plog dp 3.8 208 whp 265 at the crank 14.8 1/4
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  7. #47 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    Donating Users Vegas_Matt's Avatar
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    lol read the whole thread. i'll have to wait for the code to pop up again but i'm getting something slightly different and still running rich as fook

    <MiZzBeCcA>its not rape if you yell suprise

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  8. #48 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
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    it wont throw a code but when your cruising the car will at random max out the fuel trims making you run pig rich in an attempt to see if the rear O2 will respond to the changes in AFR.
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  9. #49 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoSHO99 View Post
    There are people who say tiny tuner has the ability to get rid of this diagnostic check.
    I've heard the same thing and I have tinytuner. I haven't found anything in it at all that gives you the ability to disable these diagnostic tests. Now if there is a new version of TT that can do it, I would like to see it. But so far, nada.
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  10. #50 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nascartech View Post
    old thread but i have a 01 gp and ever since i put in my catted dp i have gotten a code will a o2 sim work
    Ripped straight out of the GM service manual for the P0420 code you said you are getting in the PM:

    To control emissions of hydrocarbons (HC), carbon monoxide (CO), and oxides of nitrogen (NOx), a 3-way catalytic converter is used. The catalyst within the converter promotes a chemical reaction which oxidizes the HC and CO present in the exhaust gas, converting them into harmless water vapor and carbon dioxide. The catalyst also reduces NOx, converting it to nitrogen. The converter also has the ability to store excess oxygen and release the stored oxygen to promote these reactions. This oxygen storage capacity (OSC) is a measurement of the catalysts ability to control emissions. The powertrain control module (PCM) monitors this process using a heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) located in the exhaust stream past the three-way converter. When the catalyst is functioning properly, the HO2S 2 is slow to respond to a large change in the HO2S 1 signal. When the HO2S 2 responds quickly to a large change in the HO2S 1 signal, the OSC and efficiency of the catalyst is considered to be bad and if subsequent tests also indicate a failure DTC P0420 will set.
    Sounds to me like the cat that came with your DP isn't compatible with your car, or it isn't working properly.

    -ryan
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  11. #51 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
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    So if i want to run a race pipe that came with my speed daddy headers i just need to have an o2 sensor plugged into it even though there is no CAT. As long as the engine can read the o2 it wont keep running the diagnostic? Then just set the DTC's to no reporting? And everything should run a ok?
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  12. #52 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apierce1289 View Post
    So if i want to run a race pipe that came with my speed daddy headers i just need to have an o2 sensor plugged into it even though there is no CAT. As long as the engine can read the o2 it wont keep running the diagnostic? Then just set the DTC's to no reporting? And everything should run a ok?
    That's a good question. I don't know what would happen if you got rid of the cat and left the rear O2 in there. The Monte I tuned on didn't have a rear O2 or a cat so I never got to try it.

    I would say go ahead and try disabling the catalyst codes only (leave the post-O2 codes enabled) and then watch your fuel trims as you drive and see if it tries to run the cat diagnostic. It may try to run it but should soon quit running it as the rear O2 would show rich immediately as the test begins.

    Give it a try and let us know what happens.

    -ryan
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  13. #53 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    GTP Level Member 01gpgt01's Avatar
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    You will be okay with the 02 in there, It will just toss the Po420 code. If you have that code set to Non report SES enabled Checked, Then it would even pass a obd2 Emission check.
    2001 GT. A few here and there mods http://www.streetfire.net/video/2001...ynp_208097.htm

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  14. #54 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinister Performance View Post
    That's a good question. I don't know what would happen if you got rid of the cat and left the rear O2 in there. The Monte I tuned on didn't have a rear O2 or a cat so I never got to try it.

    I would say go ahead and try disabling the catalyst codes only (leave the post-O2 codes enabled) and then watch your fuel trims as you drive and see if it tries to run the cat diagnostic. It may try to run it but should soon quit running it as the rear O2 would show rich immediately as the test begins.

    Give it a try and let us know what happens.

    -ryan

    Quote Originally Posted by 01gpgt01 View Post
    You will be okay with the 02 in there, It will just toss the Po420 code. If you have that code set to Non report SES enabled Checked, Then it would even pass a obd2 Emission check.
    So if i do what you guys just suggested the car will only run the diagnostic once and should stop then my engine should remain running normal. The computer will just think it has a bad CAT and it wont effect the way the engine runs? Oh and also i don't have the software i am just doing a **** load of research to find a solution to this issue. Will the above SES code try to run more than once? So that me and everyone else will know what to do
    Last edited by apierce1289; 04-02-2011 at 11:59 PM.
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  15. #55 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    GTP Level Member 01gpgt01's Avatar
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    Yes it will always run the diagnostic to test the cat, But it will just always fail. The other way(no 02) because it doesn't get feedback the test just runs continuously. I run no rear 02 on my 2001 and have had no issues. But ive seen scans and cars that have. Hope this helps
    2001 GT. A few here and there mods http://www.streetfire.net/video/2001...ynp_208097.htm

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  16. #56 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apierce1289 View Post
    So if i do what you guys just suggested the car will only run the diagnostic once and should stop then my engine should remain running normal. The computer will just think it has a bad CAT and it wont effect the way the engine runs? Oh and also i don't have the software i am just doing a **** load of research to find a solution to this issue. Will the above SES code try to run more than once? So that me and everyone else will know what to do
    Assuming you are going to leave the rear O2 installed and the codes for it enabled (as they are stock); if you set the Cat Diagnostic DTC(s) to "No MIL", the test will run 1 time, set the Cat DTC, and then future tests will not run.

    If you disable the Cat diagnostic codes completely, the PCM may attempt to run and re-run the tests, but I would THINK it should immediately discontinue each test as soon as it sees that rear O2 sensor go rich. I do NOT know if it will keep trying to run the test of if it will discontinue running tests for that key cycle because I never had the chance to try it.
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  17. #57 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    youtu.be/xhrBDcQq2DM FoSHO99's Avatar
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    In tinytuner, go to diagnostics> cat diagnostics? and there are 2 tests to set to disable, I'm not at the program right now for specifics but I know they will disable the tests.

    Other than that if you leave the rear 02 plugged in and in the exhaust, you can make a 2" or so spacer so the sensor is out of the exhaust stream and then it won't throw a code like it would with no cat there and in the exhaust stream.
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  18. #58 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoSHO99 View Post
    In tinytuner, go to diagnostics> cat diagnostics? and there are 2 tests to set to disable, I'm not at the program right now for specifics but I know they will disable the tests.

    .
    What version of TinyTuner are you using? I have v3 and it isn't showing any cat diagnostics to disable at all...
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  19. #59 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
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    I was planning on getting a ZZP pcm, do they set the codes to no reporting or do they completely remove them? I would like to have the computer know it has a bad CAT but just not show up in emissions check so I pass that way it wont keep running it since it will think its bad. Also can someone hook me up with Overkillwill's contact info cause I'd rather pay him to get the actual diagnostic test completely removed so it will never do that test again.
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  20. #60 Re: Removing rear O2 sensor on 01-newer PCMs -- Things you should know 
    SE Level Member Sinister Performance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apierce1289 View Post
    I was planning on getting a ZZP pcm, do they set the codes to no reporting or do they completely remove them? I would like to have the computer know it has a bad CAT but just not show up in emissions check so I pass that way it wont keep running it since it will think its bad. Also can someone hook me up with Overkillwill's contact info cause I'd rather pay him to get the actual diagnostic test completely removed so it will never do that test again.
    How does the emissions testing stations in your area conduct their tests? Do they hook up their scan tools to check to see if the PCM reports a certain diagnostic test has run or not? If so, then just disabling the code will result in these tests always showing "NOT RUN" on the scan; and disabling the diagnostic may result in the same thing being displayed.

    I'm not sure what Overkillwill does, but you had better check to make sure whatever he does to disable the diagnotic test from running will report that diagnostic test result on the scan has "RUN AND PASSED"; otherwise you'll probably fail the inspection (that is if the smog guys are looking at this data).
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