Thread: Want to lower your car? Look in here!!

Page 1 of 29 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 575
  1. #1 Want to lower your car? Look in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    well, here she is, the end all be all thread for lowering your w-body. first off, let's dicuss a few things about lowering besides the lowering itself. There are pros and cons to lowering a car and there are good ways to do it and bad ways to do it.

    pros:
    - the handling of your car will increase overall
    - the asthetics will be better by reducing 'wheel gap'
    - depending upon the spring and strut combo the car may actually ride better than stock (this is relative as it is an opinion)

    cons:
    - the ride may be more stiff and harsh than stock (really depends on springs and struts used)
    - quicker wear of suspension and drivetrain components
    - premature axle wear due to the incorrect axle angle being applied, which causes vibration upon acceleration



    now, let's move into ways to lower your car. there are correct and incorrect ways to go about this, but all will work to a certain degree. Heating the coils or cutting the springs a little shorter is the way to do it wrong. The springs are compromised and their strength is no longer how it was meant to be from the factory. the risk of the springs then failing is much, much greater than if you were to just use the springs as is. the true and correct way to go about lowering your car is installing lowering springs with struts to complement them or to shell out a nice amount of money for a set of coilovers. there are numerous different brands of lowering springs, but i will cover the main sets that you will see around the forums and online. i will not cover ebay springs or non-main stream springs because i have no experience with them, nor do i care to test them all out. either way the advertised spring rates are normally incorrect. if the springs say they drop 1.5", expect 2". if the springs say 2" (intrax), expect blown struts.

    no matter what you do with the suspension, lowering your car will cause accelerated wear on the other suspension parts that go along with the springs, namely struts and strut mounts. even if you use struts meant for being lowered, their life span will be compromised more the lower you go.

    lowering springs

    i believe all of the lowering springs can be categorized into three categories: small, medium, and large drop. the farther you drop the car, the quicker the suspension parts will wear and the car will ride considerably more rough the lower you go.

    small drop springs

    these springs will be the closest to stock ride height and will ride the best and most comfy. the springs that fit into this category are mainly the ones that came as aftermarket on the car as packages. these springs include SLP and GMPP/vogtland (vogtland is the original manufacturer of GMPP springs that came on the GMPP/koni strut package). expect a 0.8" to 1.5" drop out of these springs.

    medium drop springs

    these springs will be what most people will choose when going lower. they will lower the car greatly compared to the stock right height and will leave most very satisfied with the drop compared to how it rides. the ride quality will be reduced considerably compared to stock and the wear of parts will be accelerated as well. most struts meant as stock replacements will need to be replaced every 20k miles or less with these springs. this category includes springs such as eibach, SSC, canuck, etc. expect a drop around 1.5" to 2.5" depending upon age of components used and springs chosen.

    large drop springs

    these springs are for the people looking for the slammed look. the ride will suffer greatly compared to stock and parts will wear very quickly. the only set of springs that i know of that can be categorized here are intrax. expect a 2.5" or more drop. these springs nearly tuck the tires.

    coilovers

    there are two places where you can find coilovers for our cars. one option is intense (INTENSE-Racing.com - Pontiac G8, Grand Prix, Bonneville, Regal, L67 3800 Supercharged Performance Products, Mods and Tunes.) and another option is a company that goes by HT motorsports (HT MOTORSPORTS)[i guess ZZP sells the HT motorsports coilovers now, meh]. these coilovers will be much higher quality than just lowering springs and you will be able to dial in your car how you want it. if you intend on going lower than intrax springs you either have the choice of coilovers or installing an air bag setup. this is by far the most expensive alternative, but you've got to pay to play with lowering the car.



    notes about modifying components for lowering springs

    most lowering springs will come with directions for cutting and trimming the bump stops. the only reason to do this is so that the struts can have their full length of travel before they bottom out on the bump stops. DO NOT REMOVE THE BUMP STOPS INSTEAD OF TRIMMING THEM! the bump stops are meant to be a 'soft' cushion at the end of the travel of the strut, however it is not that soft when you actually hit it. when youre riding on the bump stops it will feel like you are bottoming out your car. when trimmed properly you will not have to worry about this.



    added notes about lowering

    once your car is lowered you may develop what we like to call 'acceleration vibration'. this is due to the axles being pushed into the wrong geometry due to the motor and transmission being lower than it was when stock. this causes premature wear on the axles themselves as well as the seals on the differential and the CV joints. there are two fixes for this: shortened dogbones or motor/trans mount spacers. you also may experience what we like to call 'pogo' where the car will bounce over bumps instead of taking the hit and recovering quickly. the fix for this is to install anti-pogo washers.

    shortened dogbones

    the correct shortened dogbones have the hole 3/4" farther back center to center and the front end chopped off. this will pull the motor and transmission farther forward, essentially raising them up. this mod will cause accelerated wear of the motor/trans mounts and your exhaust may now come in contact with the radiator fan heat shield and the downpipe is raised up higher which could potentially cause problems with hitting the exhaust on the exhaust tunnel or firewall. shortening the dogbones is not the best solution, but if hood clearance is an issue then it is your only option.

    motor/trans mount spacers

    i am not sure of the thickness that the spacers need to be (somewhere in the 5/16" to 5/8" area), but their purpose is to go underneath the motor/trans mounts in order to raise them up to their original position and correct the axle geometry. the only reason as to why you wouldnt be able to run these are if you have hood clearance issues because of an intercooler or if your exhaust is already very close to the bottom of the car. this is definitely a better choice if you can run them.

    anti-pogo washers

    The top strut mount on the front fenders have a retaining nut along with a retainer cap; this will hold the strut rod, which comes through the center of the mount, in place. With the stock springs, this retainer is in direct contact against a rubber cushion underneath it, this is what directly connects the strut to the mount. With lowering springs, this retaining cap is raised up about a quarter to a half inch, so the strut is no longer firmly secured against the mount! What this means is that the spring can bounce up and down this tiny bit before the strut even begins to act on it. With the anti-pogo washers you are greeted with a much more shallow design. This new retainer will firmly press against the rubber cushion, even on a lowering spring!
    for more information on this, refer to this link: http://www.clubgp.com/cgi-asp/mods.asp?modid=68

    anti-pogo washers were also discovered to be subframe washers. use this information wisely and save a ton of money in comparison to anyone that was suckered into buying 'anti-pogo washers' from a vendor.


    that'll wrap it up for now. if you have anything else you think i missed and would like me to add please send me a PM. now, onto the pictures!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2. #2 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    recommended struts

    all struts are NOT made alike. the stock struts were made to give a soft, comfortable ride. lowering springs (depending upon drop) will destroy your stock struts fairly quickly. there are two main struts that people run around these parts, both made by KYB: GR2 and AGX. KYB GR2 are meant to be a stock replacement strut, but ride a little stiffer. These struts work well with cars that are not that low. people have run them with springs that go fairly low and have complained a lot that they tend to ride very rough and blow out quickly. this is all a matter of opinion since i ran eibach springs on GR2s for over 50k miles and i thought the car still rode very well for how low it was. KYB AGX are adjustable struts that were meant for cars being lowered. these struts will take the beating of springs that lower the car enough to make a difference. these are the highest recommended strut around these parts. they might be a little more expensive than just buying replacement struts, but when youre lowering your car every bit of help you can get is a good thing. these can be dialed in to be as soft or as hard as you want them to be, unlike stock replacement struts that will be a fixed damping rate.


    spring rates

    STOCK rate
    Front Linear 143 lb/in
    Rear Linear 120 lb/in

    Eibach
    Prokit p/n 3865.140
    Rates
    Front PROGRESSIVE rate 154/200 lbs/in
    Rear PROGRESSIVE rate 108/165 lbs/in
    Supplied #'s from Eibach
    1.3" drop front and rear
    http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/suspension-c-6.html

    B+G
    p/n 68.1.003
    Rates
    Front Linear rate 178.75 lbs/in (25%)
    Rear Linear rate 150 lbs/in (25%)
    Caculated #'s from percentages from B+G
    1.2" drop front and rear
    http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/suspension-c-6.html


    VOGTLAND
    P/N 959206
    Rates
    Front LINEAR 200 lb/in
    Rear LINEAR 140 lb/in
    Supplied #'s by Vogtland
    1.4 drop front and rear
    Sport Lowering Suspension Springs Vogtlandsuspension.com
    or these are about 20 more but are definitely in stock
    Swift Motorsports

    SSC
    No part number listed on there website
    Rates
    10-20% increase
    Front Linear 190 lb/in
    Rear Linear 140 lb/in
    As per manufacturer


    Sprint Springs
    Part # 3050
    Rates
    20% increase
    Front Linear 171.6 lb/in
    Rear Linear 144 lb/in
    Caculated #'s from percentages Sprint
    1.8" front / 1.6" rear

    CM springs (Canuck Motorsports also on eBay)
    Front Linear 190 lb/in
    Rear Linear 140 lb/in
    Supplied numbers from CM
    1.6" front & 1.4" rear drop
    eBay Motors: CM Lowering Spring GRAND PRIX 97-03 02 01 00 99 98 drop (item 170211250005 end time May-16-08 16:53:55 PDT)

    WBS Springs *updated 4/1/14*
    280 lb/in front (used to be front progressing to 400 lb/in)
    230 lb/in rear (used to be rear progressive to 350lb/in)
    Number supplied from WBS
    1.5" drop front & 1.0" drop rear (used to be 1.6" front & rear drop)
    http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/suspension-c-6.html
    Reply With Quote  
     

  3. #3 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    GMPP/vogtland springs





    eibach springs:







    intrax springs






    ebay DNA springs

    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #4 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    SSC springs













    B&G springs


    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #5 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    wbodystore springs




    springtech springs




    coilovers

    ~2.5" drop:



    ~3 drop:



    ~4" drop:


    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #6 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    space for pictures and added content. five.

    SEND ME YOUR PICTURES OF YOUR LOWERED CAR AND THE SPRINGS/STRUTS YOU ARE RUNNING. PREFERABLY A STRAIGHT SIDE SHOT ON STOCK WHEELS. I WILL POST THEM ALL HERE IN ORDER TO GIVE PEOPLE EXAMPLES!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #7 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    GXP Level Member Poil336's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Troy OH
    Posts
    2,919
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    7
    you finally did it... very nice bio. hopefully it will be put to good use in the future
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #8 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    SE Level Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    42
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    0
    id like to see a pic with the intrax springs...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #9 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    ill put a few pictures up, but id really like more pictures from everyone on the forums to deck this thread out how it should be.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #10 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    SE Level Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    atlanta
    Posts
    48
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    0
    great write up man!! noob question... i see the SSC springs.. what is ssc short for??
    Last edited by OhsoKleaN; 03-01-2010 at 09:32 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #11 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    yeah, we need to keep it up towards the top so someone stickies it. im too lazy to PM anyone..
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #12 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    GTP Level Member carl06GT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    KCMO
    Posts
    1,590
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    66
    bump
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #13 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    Your ClubGP Liason copgtp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Orange County, NY
    Posts
    1,101
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    2347
    Bio, just a quick correction: I used to run the GMPP/Vogtland setup.....the picture you have of my car is with SSC/AGX setup.

    I will post a pic of my GMPP setup for ya if you'd like?
    For all your 3800 needs:
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #14 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    DUI BABY Bio248's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    MILWAUKEE
    Posts
    31,340
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    1
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    40479
    Quote Originally Posted by copgtp View Post
    Bio, just a quick correction: I used to run the GMPP/Vogtland setup.....the picture you have of my car is with SSC/AGX setup.

    I will post a pic of my GMPP setup for ya if you'd like?
    PM it to me and ill keep the thread clean.

    ill switch the picture above as well.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #15 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    GXP Level Member Poil336's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Troy OH
    Posts
    2,919
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    7
    sexy cars... the black one needs to be smaller, i can't see from the mirror forward

    edit: it's also possibly missing a lug nut on the back wheel?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #16 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    Donating Users JESSEGOTTA GP GT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    1,142
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    0
    Nice write up Bio. This will be next for my car after the top swap.
    New project: 2000 Red GTP.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #17 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    PittState Automotive Tech GAFF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    2,161
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    3
    very nice
    SOLD 1999 GT Silvermist TS
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #18 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    GTX Level Member imdaman3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    780
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    0
    can we do a how to lift thread
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #19 Re: want to lower your car? in here!! 
    Banned - Busted For Scamming
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    32812
    Posts
    3,060
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    0
    Holy ****, the intrax springs are LOW!!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #20 Re: Want to lower your car? Look in here!! 
    Donating Users GeddyLee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    St. Louis Mo.
    Posts
    2,573
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Dislikes (Received)
    0
    Chats
    35
    Sticked at your request Bio! Many thanks for the great write up!! I will send you some photo links in a PM that might help with cutting and sizing of your strut bumpers too

    James Shafer
    2003 GP GTX SLP P/N 50066 (SOLD )
    2005 Nissan Pathfinder SE 4x4 (The baby hauler )
    St. Louis MO
    1.9 Modified Rockers, TOGs, 180 Tstat, PRJ 10.4 Wires, P/P Gen 3, SLP Ram Air Hood/Wizaired CAI, Gen 1 Spoiler, 3.4 ZZP Pulley, Desert Fox Tranny Cooler, Thrasher Shift Kit, 18" TSW Mondellos w/ AGX Struts, SSC Gen II Springs
    Reply With Quote  
     

Page 1 of 29 12311 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. About the Lower intake & S/C
    By SDGTP99 in forum 3.8L V6 Supercharged (L67)(L32)
    Replies: 27
    Last Post: 09-05-2009, 03:39 PM
  2. rear end lower
    By 52 picup in forum Brakes/Suspension/Chassis
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 10-27-2008, 01:54 AM
  3. how to lower?
    By 89prix in forum Brakes/Suspension/Chassis
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 10-24-2008, 07:17 AM
  4. Lower
    By 98GPGT in forum Brakes/Suspension/Chassis
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 10-14-2008, 07:45 PM
  5. Lower KR ?
    By stlmo_gtp in forum 3.8L V6 Supercharged (L67)(L32)
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 05-19-2008, 09:04 PM
Tags for this Thread

View Tag Cloud

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •